DPF

[DeeTurbo]

On my DS3 I was thinking of blanking my EGR valve thinking it might help with future issues if it starting leaking so saving the DPF but I was told by a tuner that it needs mapping out once once blanked else it'll prematurely fail the DPF.

I know that the EGR gasses help keep the combustion temp down so if the temps are higher could this be the reason why it would fail prematurely but don't the exhaust gasses go hotter to burn off the soot in the DPF.

I'm thinking the tuner might just want me to get a map so it's more money his way, what do you guys think?

[Piggy]

Well it will throw codes pretty quick if you just blank it.

[DeeTurbo]

If look at the pic below you can see there is a sensor in the EGR now.

The old days we used to blank at 8 but if I blank at 2 the sensor will see the pressure through the valve.

[Ruan]

Never, ever disable the EGR without removing the DPF. You risk a huge thermal runaway inside the DPF and likely a DPF fire. The ECU controls the temperature of the DPF once in regeneration by controlling the amount of oxygen flow to it. If the DPF receives too much oxygen once the regeneration has started, you risk a thermal runaway and the core will likely melt because the ECU cannot control the temperature in the DPF core. Particularly if the doser flap is disabled also, that's about the worst possible situation.

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Also, the ECU knows the flow through the EGR system - even EDC15 has the ability to throw plausibility faults with relation to low EGR flow. It knows by monitoring the drop in flow via the MAF as the valve opens, the doser closes and it forces exhaust gasses through the system instead.

[DeeTurbo]

Never, ever disable the EGR without removing the DPF. You risk a huge thermal runaway inside the DPF and likely a DPF fire. The ECU controls the temperature of the DPF once in regeneration by controlling the amount of oxygen flow to it. If the DPF receives too much oxygen once the regeneration has started, you risk a thermal runaway and the core will likely melt because the ECU cannot control the temperature in the DPF core. Particularly if the doser flap is disabled also, that's about the worst possible situation.

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Also, the ECU knows the flow through the EGR system - even EDC15 has the ability to throw plausibility faults with relation to low EGR flow. It knows by monitoring the drop in flow via the MAF as the valve opens, the doser closes and it forces exhaust gasses through the system instead.

I love you Raun!!

That's the reply to the question I've been after.

All I get on the DS3 forum is wishy washy thoughts. Facts is what I need.

So would you recommend removing the EGR valve and cleaning every service to make sure it doesn't get coked up?

[Ruan]

Nah, in honesty, these days, just leave well alone - I/my parents drove my DW10 based V50 with all emissions systems in tact from essentially new to 172k miles and did not have a single emissions system related problem. Service properly with the correct oils, drive normally, without extended idling etc, it'll be absolutely fine.

If it's a 'wet' Eolys regenerated DPF ensure the core is replaced at the correct intervals and the Eolys fluid is topped up at the correct intervals, otherwise if it's a 'dry' cDPF - it'll be fine, just ensure you don't do 5 mile journeys continuously.

[DeeTurbo]

That's great stuff, it sounds like they've sorted the emissions systems.

I think it's the dry DPF, but I'll find out.

I hardly ever do the sort journeys, I work 16 miles away mostly motorway. It's slow in the morning but not too bad on the way home.

Would branded fuel be better (not premium) with their better additives packages to be nicer for the DPF?

[ConorTRG]

Have taken out lots of egrs and left the dpf intact, and never had a problem, 1.6tdi vw will block up the dpf if the egr is deleted but everything else I've not had a problem.

[Ruan]

Have taken out lots of egrs and left the dpf intact, and never had a problem, 1.6tdi vw will block up the dpf if the egr is deleted but everything else I've not had a problem.

As said, you risk a massive thermal runaway in the DPF core, without EGR and doser valve, it's like starting a fire and pumping oxygen at it until it burns itself out, if the temperature gets too high, there's nothing the ECU can do to control the temperature.

Just because you have, doesn't mean you should, particularly the wet Eolys DPFs since the temperature the soot requires for light off is so low.

In terms of branded vs supermarket fuel... Again, drove my car on whatever fuel was available, never thought about worrying about what goes in the tank and again, did not have an issue.

[DeeTurbo]

I thought as much on the fuel front.

It looks like it's the wet system and it has the Eolys tank.

I've got 466ml left of 1100ml according to the FAP app I've just tried.


So according to the app I have 20k miles left before the DPF needs changing, is that right?

Looks like I might have glow pug or the relay issue to. I've cleared the code see if it comes back.

[Toms306]

I'm surprised you've got the Eolys system on a 2011 car. Fords changed over to cDPF around 2009 when the Euro 5 emissions came in. I just missed out on the cDPF with my 08 Focus, would have probably had less DPF issues with it if I'd had the later coated one, but I don't do the mileage you do.

FAP life on diagnostics isn't very accurate in my experience. It's totally dependant on driving style etc.

The glow plugs are used during regen so I'd get that fault sorted.

[Ruan]

In honesty, after driving a cDPF equipped car - you either pay in terms of the increased servicing costs of an Eolys catalysed filter and have lower fuel consumption that comes with, or you pay for the increased fuel consumption during the regeneration of a cDPF system - the temperature required for light-off is much higher with a cDPF system than with Eolys. PSA developed the Eolys system so have continued to use it, Ford put focus into their own cDPF system, particularly on the later 2.0 DW based engines with the fuel atomizer in the exhaust etc.

[Toms306]

Ah, I didn't realise PSA continued to use it. It was never that effective on the Fords for some reason, not sure if they were mapped differently maybe.

I've recently changed to a car with a cDPF so will see how it compares to both the Eolys one and the DPF delete. Too soon to say yet but the early signs are better so far. No failed regens, fan running on or diesel filled oil in the first 500 miles which is considerably better than the first 500 miles of the Eolys one!

[DeeTurbo]

Good to see you back on here Tom.

What's the new car you've now got?

[Toms306]

Good to see you back on here Tom.

What's the new car you've now got?

Thanks Dee. Seems like it's mostly tumble weed on here now but glad to see you're still going through your cars properly and getting everything sorted!

Just got a later Focus with the 8v DV6, not a car I particularly want or like but with clamping down on DPF deletes, the legal issues, MOT changes coming up, and not being able to insure the remap these days I had to find something else that was standard with the same running costs, comfort and practicality...Golfs were well out of budget so I'm stuck with another Focus for now. Bought this one quite cheap and have spent most of this month fixing it, cars aren't made like they used to be! Needed a small, modern petrol with my mileage really but the diesels are far cheaper to buy as no-one wants them now they're apparently killing everyone lol.

[DeeTurbo]

Thanks Tom.

Would you guy say it's normal to get a little hesitation when coming back on the gas, I was watching the FAP app as I was doing it and I noticed the EGR values go up when doing it?

[Toms306]

Yeah that's normal if you're being gentle with the throttle. You'll probably notice the same thing when pulling away gently as well. It's all about reducing NOx under low load.

[DeeTurbo]

It feels bloody awful

Gutted I can't blank the bloody thing.

It's weird seeing to soot on the exhaust tip when washing the car, DPF must be working well lol.

[Toms306]

That's the modern drive feel unfortunately... You do get a bit used to it over time though, are you using this alone atm or this and the 306?

[DeeTurbo]

Yesterday and today I've used the estate in the snow.

The red Dturbo I've gone down to once a week at the moment. It'll be coming off the road at the end of this month then the GTI will be on the road.

I don't think I can sell the Dturbo on.

I might sell the GTI on at the end of the summer.

[Toms306]

I forgot you had so many 306s lol. I'm not one for getting attached to cars, but if I'd bought one new and owned it for 18 years I don't think I'd want to sell it either. What's the mileage on it now?

Tbh, I'm not sure you'll get used to the drive of the DS3 while you're using the 306s as well. After 3.5 years of the mk2 Focus I didn't like the Mk3 at all at first, but it has grown on me a bit since I've been using just that one...

[DeeTurbo]

Haha, yep got a right collection. I just need a cab and sedan to complete the set.

I'm only up to 347k at the moment.

I'm starting to get used to the way the DS3 drives now. It's very smooth but there is a little clutch judder that annoys me. I really need to sort the gear shift cables out. At the moment they are a little stiff and don't feel to great.

I've ordered a pivot box thing and some cables off ebay. I'm going to have a look at the pivot box and see if that can be improved in any way and I'm thinking if I can remove the rubber around the cup that the ball of the lever fits on to I'm thinking it might feel a little better also a bit of lub on the cables should help things.

[Toms306]

You'll have to get it to 350k before taking it off the road lol!

Does the DS3 have a DMF? There's always a little bit of a clutch wobble when engaging with a DMF so might just be that rather than the clutch. Good luck with the gear cables, hopefully they'll smooth out the shifts a bit!

[DeeTurbo]

A few people have said that now lol.

I thought it would be that but it seems this model doesn't. It seems the 90bhp doesn't and the 110bhp one do.

I drove the red Dturbo yesterday, love driving that car. I did think about putting a DV6 in to it but with it being a lighter engine I thought it would totally change the way the car felt so chose against it. I would love to do it in a different 306 though.