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Buying Advice Please - athingofbeauty - 15-09-2013
Hello All,
I'm new to the world of PUG and am thinking of buying a 306 diesel as a daily hack. There doesn't seem to be a buyers guide on here - I searched and got nowhere. Have I missed it?
So - I do approx 250-275 mile per week - mostly A and B roads. I spend about 20% of the time in 5th so you get the idea. 20% is on narrow windy single track Yorkshire B roads where some of the hairpins are 1st gear up hill. I do love the Pennines but my bank balance doesn't. I'm on first name terms with all the local petrol stations as I drive a Subaru Forester! I'm getting approx. 26mpg when I drive like a vicar!!
So the plan is to get a 306 diesel. I'm thinking of the pros and cons of XUD vs. HDI if anyone can advise. I want something reliable and economical.
What about these????
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=161106759316&ssPageName=ADME:B:SS:GB:1123
or less work here;
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/290963220598?ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1423.l2649
All advice appreciated. Thanks,
Steven
RE: Buying Advice Please - 4WayDiablo - 15-09-2013
For uber cheap motoring the xud can't be beaten as they run on veg oil at £1 a litre tops its real cheap. Plus parts are nice and cheap
Hdi does have its benefits. Usually a nicer a car as they're newer and usually better specs. They will average better mpg than a xud but can't run on veg and you'll be paying £1.40 at the pumps. They are more refined than an xud and it depends how hardcore you want to go on cheap motoring
RE: Buying Advice Please - athingofbeauty - 15-09-2013
(15-09-2013, 02:10 PM)4WayDiablo Wrote: For uber cheap motoring the xud can't be beaten as they run on veg oil at £1 a litre tops its real cheap. Plus parts are nice and cheap
Hdi does have its benefits. Usually a nicer a car as they're newer and usually better specs. They will average better mpg than a xud but can't run on veg and you'll be paying £1.40 at the pumps. They are more refined than an xud and it depends how hardcore you want to go on cheap motoring
Thanks for the response. Not fussed about veggie oil. The wife thinks the high useage of veggie oil in cars is increasing the demand for palm oil which is killing off the wildlife habitats for uranutans etc. which is a fair point.
What refinements does the HDI have over the XUD? Are parts cheap for the HDI? What are the pros and cons as I understand the HDI is ECU based so I suppose its more reliable but when it goes wrong it has to visit the garage???
Is there a buyers guide on here at all? Thanks.
RE: Buying Advice Please - 4WayDiablo - 15-09-2013
I don't know if there is a buyer guide. Suppose one should be made at some point.
The HDI is ECU based but is a more refined engine in that they're a lot smoother, quieter and achieve better mpg (around 10%)
Parts are still cheap for the HDI just a tad more for engine things
The xud and hdi are just as reliable as each other in standard form. As long as its been looked after, serviced and so on they can both do hundreds of thousands of miles
Never heard anyone running palm oil but don't know if the XUD will. I can't see why not as I've seen people run Engine oil, gbox oil, petrol,wd40, 2-stroke, and obviously diesel
If you get a bookers/Costco/makro card you can pick up veg these days for below 90ppl
Or if you want you can buy filter system and filter Waste Veg oil (WVO) from the local chippy/pubs which can work out as low as 50ppl
RE: Buying Advice Please - Toms306 - 15-09-2013
If you're not using veg might as well go for a HDi, and get a stage 1 remap on it for more mpg (and more power, they are really slow as standard lol). Will still only do about 50mpg average though, but obviously that's better than the Forrester.
Tbf there's not a huge amount to go wrong with a HDi, usually just sensors which are easily replaced, TPS and MAF are the usual culprits.
HDi also means you'll get the phase 3 luxuries which include nicer bodykit (bumpers, skirts, colour coding etc), clear headlights and fogs, bigger brakes, discs all round, working ABS, auto wipers, nicer looking dash with silver trim and various other bits. Also most come with air con....but it won't work anyway lol.
Get a Y reg HDi and the tax is only £130 a year too.
RE: Buying Advice Please - athingofbeauty - 15-09-2013
Thanks for the advice folks. I had thought that the HDI was much more expensive to run in terms of repairs than an XUD but i'm new to this scene. I have a young family so safety is important so perhaps i should go for an HDI. I don't want the hassle of veggie oil at this stage. Whats involved in a stage 1 re-map then, and what are the costs? Does this not put the engine under too much strain and will it become less reliable? The £130 tax is appealing. Think I might be swaying towards an HDI.
What goes wrong with these cars as the rear beams seem to be a problem - Do they snap?
RE: Buying Advice Please - Jimbo - 15-09-2013
No the bearings can collapse in the trailing arms.
Beams are everywhere and can be picked up cheap second hand so not a problem
RE: Buying Advice Please - 4WayDiablo - 15-09-2013
(15-09-2013, 02:48 PM)athingofbeauty Wrote: Thanks for the advice folks. I had thought that the HDI was much more expensive to run in terms of repairs than an XUD but i'm new to this scene. I have a young family so safety is important so perhaps i should go for an HDI. I don't want the hassle of veggie oil at this stage. Whats involved in a stage 1 re-map then, and what are the costs? Does this not put the engine under too much strain and will it become less reliable? The £130 tax is appealing. Think I might be swaying towards an HDI.A remap can be done yourself for the price of a 'KWP2000+' from eBay (around £30) and the price of a map, depending who you go to can be £30-£150
What goes wrong with these cars as the rear beams seem to be a problem - Do they snap?
I believe pro Steve or mr whippy will do the whole thing for you for around £150 last time I saw. May be cheaper now
It will go from 90bhp to around 120-130 on a standard HDI
They're detuned from factory to not smoke when in 40degree heat and to be uber good on emissions, remapping them puts them back to where they should be with a little extra. Never heard of a stage 1 hdi having any problems at all due to the extra power. Even the stage 2 guys at 160bhp don't have problems.
Rear beams are usualy around the end of thier life when you pick them up they will pretty much always be 100kplus on the mileage. But theyre dirt cheap to replace (£60-100)l
A mate of mine actually got a remap for the price of fuel for a lift (20miles and back)
Another mate got a full remap put on for him for £30.
Just have to sweet talk someone who has a map and laptop to remap
RE: Buying Advice Please - Mattcheese31 - 15-09-2013
(15-09-2013, 02:20 PM)athingofbeauty Wrote:(15-09-2013, 02:10 PM)4WayDiablo Wrote: For uber cheap motoring the xud can't be beaten as they run on veg oil at £1 a litre tops its real cheap. Plus parts are nice and cheap
Hdi does have its benefits. Usually a nicer a car as they're newer and usually better specs. They will average better mpg than a xud but can't run on veg and you'll be paying £1.40 at the pumps. They are more refined than an xud and it depends how hardcore you want to go on cheap motoring
Thanks for the response. Not fussed about veggie oil. The wife thinks the high useage of veggie oil in cars is increasing the demand for palm oil which is killing off the wildlife habitats for uranutans etc. which is a fair point.
What refinements does the HDI have over the XUD? Are parts cheap for the HDI? What are the pros and cons as I understand the HDI is ECU based so I suppose its more reliable but when it goes wrong it has to visit the garage???
Is there a buyers guide on here at all? Thanks.
bahahahaahahah wow that's funny . . . .i'm laughing so hard i can't think of a funny retort . .
RE: Buying Advice Please - athingofbeauty - 15-09-2013
(15-09-2013, 03:07 PM)Mattcheese31 Wrote: bahahahaahahah wow that's funny . . . .i'm laughing so hard i can't think of a funny retort . .
What's so funny?
RE: Buying Advice Please - 4WayDiablo - 15-09-2013
Personally I think the other half's argument for not using veg oil isn't very sturdy and I think matt shares the same view
But I see that there is no point trying to tell you otherwise. Each to their own and all that
Not running veg yourself wont make a difference
RE: Buying Advice Please - athingofbeauty - 15-09-2013
(15-09-2013, 03:36 PM)4WayDiablo Wrote: Personally I think the other half's argument for not using veg oil isn't very sturdy and I think matt shares the same view
But I see that there is no point trying to tell you otherwise. Each to their own and all that
Not running veg yourself wont make a difference
Ahh OK. To be honest, I'm with you but out for a quiet life! There has been a big increase in the use of Palm oil recently which is removing their habitats but i dont think its due to veggie oil in Pugs! Its down to food manufacturers using it in junk food.
Anyway, back to the topic. What's a late, low mileage HDI gonna cost me to buy, roughly? Are we talking £1000-£1500?
RE: Buying Advice Please - 4WayDiablo - 15-09-2013
(15-09-2013, 03:55 PM)athingofbeauty Wrote:yup, around that price range for a decent low mileage, may be hard to find as most hdi's are well over 100k these days(15-09-2013, 03:36 PM)4WayDiablo Wrote: Personally I think the other half's argument for not using veg oil isn't very sturdy and I think matt shares the same view
But I see that there is no point trying to tell you otherwise. Each to their own and all that
Not running veg yourself wont make a difference
Ahh OK. To be honest, I'm with you but out for a quiet life! There has been a big increase in the use of Palm oil recently which is removing their habitats but i dont think its due to veggie oil in Pugs! Its down to food manufacturers using it in junk food.
Anyway, back to the topic. What's a late, low mileage HDI gonna cost me to buy, roughly? Are we talking £1000-£1500?
RE: Buying Advice Please - Mattcheese31 - 15-09-2013
(15-09-2013, 03:55 PM)athingofbeauty Wrote:(15-09-2013, 03:36 PM)4WayDiablo Wrote: Personally I think the other half's argument for not using veg oil isn't very sturdy and I think matt shares the same view
But I see that there is no point trying to tell you otherwise. Each to their own and all that
Not running veg yourself wont make a difference
Ahh OK. To be honest, I'm with you but out for a quiet life! There has been a big increase in the use of Palm oil recently which is removing their habitats but i dont think its due to veggie oil in Pugs! Its down to food manufacturers using it in junk food.
Anyway, back to the topic. What's a late, low mileage HDI gonna cost me to buy, roughly? Are we talking £1000-£1500?
spot on mate, you've just fetched yourself back from the brink of me ripping the piss out of you on any occasion and all the time . .
RE: Buying Advice Please - Scott - 15-09-2013
Be nice Mr Cheese
Welcome to the club, hope you're able to find the car you're looking for!
RE: Buying Advice Please - Mattcheese31 - 15-09-2013
(15-09-2013, 10:00 PM)Scott Wrote: Be nice Mr Cheese
Welcome to the club, hope you're able to find the car you're looking for!
yes you're right Scott . . anyway my tip is Xud and run it on Veg . . . .
RE: Buying Advice Please - Tom - 15-09-2013
Sounds like you want a hdi. In my personal experience i have never thought xud's were that good on fuel. I mean they're no petrol but they're definately nothing to brag about. Hdi is alot better on fuel. And definately sounds like the better option for you.
RE: Buying Advice Please - Mattcheese31 - 15-09-2013
HDI is better on fuel yes, but fuel for a HDI doesn't cost 92ppl now does it . .
RE: Buying Advice Please - Curt - 15-09-2013
Not everyone wants to run veg though, whether it be for convenience or smell or whatever.
Welcome along, good luck on your hunt
RE: Buying Advice Please - Tom - 15-09-2013
Yeah thats the point, this guy sounds like he just wants a car thats better on fuel, and doesnt really want to be filtering veg. In which case the hdi will do twice the mpg he gets now, happy chappy, and it wont sound shit.
RE: Buying Advice Please - Jonny81191 - 16-09-2013
4WayDiablo ' Wrote: Even the stage 2 guys at 160bhp don't have problems.
Is that so?! So cutting out, broken fuel pumps, worn out turbos etc.. They're not problems?
However, a stage 1 will be fine. I've never known a stage 1 to cause issues that weren't already there
RE: Buying Advice Please - Mattcheese31 - 16-09-2013
i don't filter veg, that's clean rapeseed price, but as you say each to their own.....we've gotta take care of the monkeys lol
RE: Buying Advice Please - adamm306 - 16-09-2013
is it really worth it with veg though 92ppl would cost 59.80 to fill up and the hassle of buying it and putting it etc when you can just go down the garage and brim it for 75-80 not really worth the hassle for 20 quid unless you're very poor
RE: Buying Advice Please - THE_Liam - 16-09-2013
I'm paying £16.79 for 20 litres from Costco, so if you run the tank totally dry its only £50.33 for 500 miles, no filtering required. I'll soon be getting it free though...
Both HDi and XUD are good engines, HDi is far more refined but does have occasional sensor issues, needs an uprated clutch for big power and has no intercooler as standard, XUD is cheaper to tune, has pretty much no sensors and no ECU, can run veg but is as clattery as an old bus
RE: Buying Advice Please - Mattcheese31 - 16-09-2013
(16-09-2013, 08:24 AM)adamm306 Wrote: is it really worth it with veg though 92ppl would cost 59.80 to fill up and the hassle of buying it and putting it etc when you can just go down the garage and brim it for 75-80 not really worth the hassle for 20 quid unless you're very poor
i make it more like a £30 saving per tank by my reckoning, it's as fast to fill up if you know what you're doing and don't be cheeky.....i'm not poor i just like having an extra £800 in my bank at the end of the year
RE: Buying Advice Please - adamm306 - 16-09-2013
(16-09-2013, 08:32 AM)THE_Liam Wrote: I'm paying £16.79 for 20 litres from Costco
not everybody has access to stores like costco/booker etc as i say even for 30 quid is it really worth it? maybe im just lazy lol
(16-09-2013, 08:37 AM)Mattcheese31 Wrote: i make it more like a £30 saving per tank by my reckoning, it's as fast to fill up if you know what you're doing and don't be cheeky.....i'm not poor i just like having an extra £800 in my bank at the end of the year
haha fair point you cant be poor if you own a 306 repairs alone costs £800 a year at least
Re: RE: Buying Advice Please - THE_Liam - 16-09-2013
(16-09-2013, 08:54 AM)adamm306 Wrote:(16-09-2013, 08:32 AM)THE_Liam Wrote: I'm paying £16.79 for 20 litres from Costco
not everybody has access to stores like costco/booker etc as i say even for 30 quid is it really worth it? maybe im just lazy lol
Costco cards are easy to get and 30 quid a tank is 60-90 quid a month, that's worth saving in my opinion...
RE: Buying Advice Please - Mattcheese31 - 16-09-2013
i'm guessing someone doesn't have bills to pay lol.......anyway horses for courses but i love my Xud and the fact i can fill up at the supermarket, forecourt or warehouse, oh and the fact i have more BHP than most HDI's on a stage 1
RE: Buying Advice Please - adamm306 - 16-09-2013
to be fair it all depends on how many miles you do really. i brim mine £75 quidish then that will last me 5 maybe 6 weeks so its not really an issue for me but for this guy id recommend veg if for the amount of miles hes doing
and trust me i have plenty of bills im not as flush as i make out
Re: RE: Buying Advice Please - kentiiboii - 16-09-2013
(16-09-2013, 08:54 AM)adamm306 Wrote:(16-09-2013, 08:32 AM)THE_Liam Wrote: I'm paying £16.79 for 20 litres from Costco
not everybody has access to stores like costco/booker etc as i say even for 30 quid is it really worth it? maybe im just lazy lol
(16-09-2013, 08:37 AM)Mattcheese31 Wrote: i make it more like a £30 saving per tank by my reckoning, it's as fast to fill up if you know what you're doing and don't be cheeky.....i'm not poor i just like having an extra £800 in my bank at the end of the year
haha fair point you cant be poor if you own a 306 repairs alone costs £800 a year at least
Well if you think about it. Most people probably get through a tank of fuel in 2 weeks? Your saving £30 a tank.
That's £780 a year! Thats about a months worth of wages to someone on minimum wage!
Welcomed to the club btw.
My hdi is coming up for sale.
It's currently on 108k in very good condition. Never skipped a beat.