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Road speed noise
It never rains but pours......

Anyways a noise has started to happen with the car that seems to be road wheel speed related. The wife recons its coming from the near side front while seem to recon its coming from the off side front, we both recon its coming from the front then, hopefully not from the gearbox !!!

There has been a wheel bearing type noise for sometime but not serious, g/box oil level and condition was checked regularly.

This new noise has come on relatively quickly and recently.

Does anyone have info like g/box  exploded views etc. ( will try and get into service box for them but I don't have internet at home, so any help there would be greatly appreciated ) that could help me trace this noise.

The noise is like something may be stuck in the brake caliper and touching the abs ring, a bit like a kid with a stick running along a railing fence, you get the idea. It seems toooo fast for a wheel bearing type noise at low speed, and it drowned out with increasing speed, but plainly heard at about 10mph.

At faster speeds there is a wheel bearing type rumble noise.

Both noises vary with direction, being noisier on left lock than right lock. Full lock in a car park at low speed does not seem an issue. It does not seem to vary with drive/overrun.

I will start at the outside of the onion with the easy stuff like maybe tyre tread and look for anything touching the abs ring and disc vent holes, as well as drive shafts, and work inwards ?

I will be getting the car up in the air over the weekend and looking/listening underneath for this noise. I will also check the back wheels ( will do them first I think ! ) just to rule them out.

The gearbox is a BE3R with a BVM5 transmission according to the pug service box data sheet for this car.

I suspect that under the tin cover on the gearbox near side end there are 2 large nuts with lock tabs ? to keep the gearbox shaft components and bearings in place ? Any known issues with them, coming loose maybe  ?  Also any known issues with crown wheel bearings and diff carrier bolts ??

From memory the speedo does not have a cable drive but the speedo drive may also cause this noise ? as well as the intermediate shaft support bearing system ????

When I arrive at the gearbox ( hopefully something is found before there ) I will drain the oil and see what comes out, but is there a magnet to catch bits inside the g/box ???

Anyone else had a similar noise and what was found please ?

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in my limited knowledge, given the symptoms you've said, I'd suggest a CV joint failing.
It goes, it stops (as reqd). Makeup
Hate Housework!
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Thanks for the reply.

Noise is defo on near side front. No apparent wheel bearing play, tyre wheel and wheel bolts ok. Some corrosion on abs ring that may have been fouling the sensor blade, but a defo gap there now. Noise still there and seems to be 8 kicks/kluncks per wheel revolution.

Will be removing the caliper next then the disc, then its hub unit off........

Cant finally decide 100% if noise is not coming from g/box but shafts seem to be in place, no bearing play/shaft play  there and no oil leaks.

will know more this afo.

I would imaging the wheel bearing may have 2 rows of 8 balls. manual shows cv joint so will check how many balls the outer cv joint has.

No clickety clackety noise on full lock when car driven in car park on full lock, so cv joint ok? , here's hoping anyway.
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Caliper removed, no apparent wheel bearing play or anything fouling the caliper/disc set up. Noise still there and some "notchyness" felt whilst rotating the disc.

Seems more and more to be coming from the wheel bearing.

Refitted brakes and checked hub centre nut. Not loose so loosened off.

Cv joint moved in the hub so not stuck/seized in there.

Pushed back shaft against spring and rotated disc, noise seems to be coming from the wheel bearing area.

Undid all nuts etc to allow cv joint removal from the hub unit, and hub unit removal from the car.

I had to sacrifice the anti roll bar drop link as the nuts where well and truelly corroded on. No flats on the ball joint shaft on these plastic drop links.

Cv joint out of hub unit, noise still in hub unit and notchyness felt, so a wheel bearing problem.

Hub unit hub removed and bearing balls and cages removed from the hub. Bearing outer races still in hub as circlip well and truelly corroded in.

Etch marks from plastic cage clearly seen on inner race "inner race" and on other surfaces, which would account for the loud noise.

will post pics when all of the bearing is out of the hub unit and ready for installing new bearing assembly.

Some water must have got past the rubber seals and the idle time between Jan and april withn the car stationery for that time, added to any "etching" and resultant bad noise.

The wheel bearing on the off side front may also be similarly effected, but one side at a time.

No issues with rotated shaft in gearbox heard but the acid test will be when I next drive the car I suppose.

The strut is off the car and the top turn plate checked, all good. Time to strip the strut down, fit new top gaiter ( if I can get one as the one on it is torn ) and paint the parts before re fitting. This is a job I have been planning for a while but not done as I knew the anti roll bar drop link nuts where gunna be a problem. The are not a problem now apart from the cost of a new drop link.

The hub abs sensor is well and truelly stuck in the hub so great care is needed, else a new one of those as well. I'm having great fun!!
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Its out at last.

Took many heat cycles and then rapid cooling in water as well as tapping but the circlip finally let go being corroded into the groove, and started to be able to be turned. |Then it was easy to get the dam thing out.

I gently tapped the eye of the circlip to make it turn in the groove before attempting to remove the circlip.

With the eyes gap at 12 o clock it tapped the 1 o clock eye anti clock wise to make the clip rotate in that direction. Clockwise for the 11 o clock eye, lubing well.

Once the clip is "free" it came out easy.

take your time doing this else break off an eye and a whole new world of problems, but migs are great and can easily save the day

next is the well and truly stuck outer to follow.
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Intermediate bearing I guess, also check the mounts if that bearing is worn because bad mounts cause excessive movement of gearbox therefore shaft therefore wears the bearing faster
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I was wondering about possible engine movement when cornering as I have had an intermittent loss of power problem when hard cornering to the left, but it is defo the left wheel bearing as pictures will show.

When car re assembled and road tested hopefully all wheel bearing type noise will have disappeared.

3 1/2 t pressure on the press gauge to move the outer race from the hub, a large crack or bang but no damage.

Outer now out, cleaning up hub for bearing replacement today.

Some bad corrosion on circlip area and on bearing outer end, making outer removal via press  quite a job.
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ref drop links -
I was recommended to get these;
It goes, it stops (as reqd). Makeup
Hate Housework!
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[Image: 21e5e404e29efed13738507d032422bd.jpg]Those dreaded little buggers, or the nuts that hold them on more like !!

The ones on the car when we got it looked newish and plastic. All good until they need to be removed. The allan key hole in the end of the stub is a joke really. The nuts where seized on and no flats on the ball joint stub. So the one on the near side was ground off.

The ball joints themselves where all good, but now knackered as the nut etc was ground off. No good heating the seized nut as the ball joint cup etc. is plastic.

I looked at the metal types which were slightly cheaper ( just under £8 each from memory inc vat ) but went for 2 new plastic types at just under £9 each inc vat at my first port of call motor factors. These have the allan key hole and flats for easier possible removal.

Build a relationship with your local motor factor and get very near or actual trade prices.

ECP are sometimes cheaper but are 20 miles away from me.

The local motor factors are in the village.

Been trying to get into service box parts diagrams for the top of the strut, need part number for the top strut gaiter.........for a 1999/2000 hdi estate 2 l diesel 306.

 Is this diagram at the top ( taken from an earlier thread on page 3 ) correct for our car please ??

Just been to the guides section, someone should start a parts exploded view and part number section please, to save all this info before pug uk pull the plug on it.

Saw the guide about front strut spring replacement etc. Whilst in town today I bought a silverline 1/2inch drive £1.67 21mm socket to make a tool to undo the strut damper rod nut from the top mount, so I can fit a new damper gaiter and paint all the parts to keep corrosion at bay.

I will weld a "handle" to the socket, so I can turn the socket, and pass an allan key thru the 1/2inch square hole to stop the strut damper rod from turning.

That's the theory anyway.

I just hope that works rather than the mole grips method. If you have to use the mole grip method, do it at the top of the damper rod stroke, else the seals will get ripped to hell and oil will leak. If your scrapping the struts, it don't matter, but if you are re fitting the struts, it does.
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A swan-neck spanner of the correct size works well for removing/installing the top nut that holds the whole strut assembly together.  Most garages just use an impact wrench though. They'll do the job without having to hold the damper shaft.

I say 'of the correct size' because they're not all 21mm.
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Diagram looks identical to the one pug parts gave to me, 50A10A, part 3, 5254 13 shock absorber rod protector, 2 for less than £19 inc vat, arrive Monday or so they say, but they will phone me when they do arrive.

Another day out on the buses ( 3 ! ) for us again next week then !

I don't have a whizzy gun but what happens when the nut frees off its clamping and the whizzy just whizzes the nut and damper rod round and round. At least the nut will not be tight in that instance I suppose ?

Don't have a spanner that will fit the quite deeply recessed nut......

2 quid and a bit of welding to make a purpose made tool aint gunna break the bank.
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any pics?
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Nearly at the new bearing press in stage, waiting for paint to dry...........hopefully pressing in bearing on sunday, so all pics will be posted monday.

The parts diagram for the top of the strut shows a replaceable strut "bearing"..........

The special strut top nut tool worked great, and the strut bottom plate ( thought that would have been welded to the strut damper body but it wasn't ! ) freed off but was not removable.  

The strut spring took some compressing, it looks as if its quite long when "de compressed".

Anyone have the length of the strut spring when de compressed please, as i would like to de compress for de rusting and repainting but feel as thought the compressor clamps I have will not be long enough ???
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    Hope this works a pic in focus etc of the inner inner race, the one by the circlip.....ok, but did not place under the text.

This is the inner race that fits right by the circlip, and was very noisy when car going to the left at speed. This was the side that was noisy and notchy when the front of the car was up in the air.

As said earlier the car had been making a wheel bearing type noise but since the car was laid up in January till april this year, the noise was much louder in april, and very noisy when going to the left. A slight vibration was felt thru the steering wheel also.

There is etching on this race as well as on the outer track, and similar on the balls, 13 per race. All the balls show orange peel, some matt areas, etching and some pitting. A picture of these was difficult to take so I didnt bother showing them. The circlip was well corroded.

I can only conclude that moisture has got into the bearing during the layup and caused/increased the etching. There was no wheel bearing play felt.

Didn't have a chance to press the new bearing in at the weekend as the lad tried unsuccessfully to kill his mondy.

Will post final report when car back on road with no noises, I hope.
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