Astor hdi daily

[Matt-Rallye]

If thats the case zakk then we will whip the cam cover etc off tomorrow afternoon? if its broken a rocker we can fix that and re-time it

[Midnightclub]

Yeah not ideal, think it's got another 10-20k before it needs one though so should be all good. Done nearly 80k in it now haha

[Matt-Rallye]

Mines in the garage having HP pump, cambelt and water pump done today hopefully i shouldn't have these issues

[bashbarnard]

Had no idea these didnt bust the valves. New information.

[Matt-Rallye]

Had no idea these didnt bust the valves. New information.

Not a bad thing! Still not as good as the old 1.7 isuzu non interference lumps! cambelt snapping is a minor inconvenience

[ozonehostile]

Well the head is fine it turns out, the big bang and all the metallic rattling and clattering must've been the high pressure pump having a tragic death so I retrieved it from outside matts unit the other night and this morning I have replaced:

Hp pump from an engine that was running and driving a couple of days ago, the injectors again, the fuel rail, the fuel rail sensor, the fuel pump relay, the fuel pressure regulator and yet still it's the same f*cking problem! 

Runs drives absolutely fine at idle and first gear, you can red line it in first and doesn't miss a beat, however you floor it in 2nd and it will instantly die at 2700 rpm and refuse to start again for 5 minutes or so. Every single time. 

I really can't figure out what else to try now as it's driving me insane. I've tried 3 different sets of fuel pressure regs and various sensors, even transferred everything off a complete working engine I bought and it's still the same. 

The timing seems to be perfect, you can turn it as many times as you like and the timing holes match up perfectly, Peugeot planet brings up po230 fault with high pressure fuel monitoring fault. 

Really stumped now tbh

[Paul_13]

Lp pump?

[Piggy]

Torque limiter in 1st isnt there?
So more fuel/load in second thus causing fault.

Is LP ok?

[cully]

clean the earths on the chassis leg and gearbox

[ozonehostile]

The lp is working fine and has a steady 6v going to the plug. Which makes it even more annoying. 

One theory my old man suggested is that the new cam pulley being the older style from the earlier hdi engines, doesn't have the same holes for the cam position sensor. I'm trying that today by changing the pulley again as I it would make sense if the cam sensor was getting a false signal and the ecu then shuts everything down to protect the engine. 

I also tried cleaning the earth's and made no difference

[Toms306]

Can you watch PP while taking for a thrash? (Passenger needed lol)

If so, check the requested vs actual pressure, does sound like lift pump not keeping up with demand to me.

Also check the cam and crank synchronisation, though I've had cam/crank lose sync stationary so it doesn't sound like your issue imo.

[ozonehostile]

Changed cam pulley to correct type with two short gaps and two long like the one that originally broke, changed cam sensor, car wouldn't start. Just cranks. 

Eventually started after a boost from the jump leads and about 5 minutes of cranking. Took it for a drive and it STILL f*cking CUTS OUT!!

Pp2k, still comes up with intermittent high pressure fuel monitoring fault apart from now it won't start again at all no matter what. 

On pp2k all voltages to sensors are there when it's running, cam and crank are synchronised, there's fuel pressure, there's injector voltage, all is well until 2700 rpm in 2nd gear when it dies instantly. 

Lp is priming, fuel is getting to the rail and each injector but for some reason it just won't start now at all. 

Never known anything like it

---

Changed cam pulley to correct type with two short gaps and two long like the one that originally broke, changed cam sensor, car wouldn't start. Just cranks. 

Eventually started after a boost from the jump leads and about 5 minutes of cranking. Took it for a drive and it STILL f*cking CUTS OUT!!

Pp2k, still comes up with intermittent high pressure fuel monitoring fault apart from now it won't start again at all no matter what. 

On pp2k all voltages to sensors are there when it's running, cam and crank are synchronised, there's fuel pressure, there's injector voltage, all is well until 2700 rpm in 2nd gear when it dies instantly. 

Lp is priming, fuel is getting to the rail and each injector but for some reason it just won't start now at all. 

Never known anything like it

[Poodle]

Cam/crank sync would bring up a code. Pretty sure the lift pump should have 12V going to it, so i'd be investigating that.

[bashbarnard]

Yeah lift pump is 12 vault feed. Only just had to wire mine in.

[ozonehostile]

Hmm interesting, I'll look into that 

What I can't work out at the moment is why it's refusing to start at all, I have no fault codes on pp2k, I have lift pump supply to the fuel filter, I have healthy rail pressure while cranking it over, I have really good compression, working pressure regulator, cam and crank sensor synchronisation, injector supply voltage, but still it won't fire. 

I think I'll try a different map just in case the ecu has somehow died or corrupted

---

Hmm interesting, I'll look into that 

What I can't work out at the moment is why it's refusing to start at all, I have no fault codes on pp2k, I have lift pump supply to the fuel filter, I have healthy rail pressure while cranking it over, I have really good compression, working pressure regulator, cam and crank sensor synchronisation, injector supply voltage, but still it won't fire. 

I think I'll try a different map just in case the ecu has somehow died or corrupted

---

Hmm interesting, I'll look into that 

What I can't work out at the moment is why it's refusing to start at all, I have no fault codes on pp2k, I have lift pump supply to the fuel filter, I have healthy rail pressure while cranking it over, I have really good compression, working pressure regulator, cam and crank sensor synchronisation, injector supply voltage, but still it won't fire. 

I think I'll try a different map just in case the ecu has somehow died or corrupted

[Ruan]

What pressure is the rail seeing during cranking?

What's the OCR% on the Relief Valve?

[Poodle]

If the ecu has grenaded another map won't help, it'll need another ecu.

[Matt-Rallye]

Seriously this thing is f*cking cursed.

[ozonehostile]

What pressure is the rail seeing during cranking?

What's the OCR% on the Relief Valve?

I'll plug it in tomorrow and take some screen shots

---

If the ecu has grenaded another map won't help, it'll need another ecu.

I'm just trying everything that could possibly have gone wrong. It's just infuriating having nothing to go off symptom wise as it seems to have everything it needs to run but just won't

[Poodle]

Cursed? It's a large mechanical linkage, it's all just nuts and bolts once you get your head around the ecu, just needs structured diagnosis. It is sounding a lot like a dead ecu, although it's odd that it had running issues before that, they normally just die without warning. Get a look at the live data and see what's happening, if the ecu communicates with pp then it's probably fine. The lift pump only getting 6 volts is what i'd be looking at, most likely an issue with the brown relay or wiring.

[cully]

The lift pump only getting 6 volts is what i'd be looking at, most likely an issue with the brown relay or wiring.

look at the loom plugs above the passengers feet the connectors for the fuel pump burn in this connector

[ozonehostile]

Ah I'll give that a look later

Just need to get it running for convineance now as I'm picking up a new car on the weekend

[ozonehostile]

Had some time spare this evening so thought I would change the one thing left that I hadn't touched since I serviced it. The fuel filter itself. 

Aaaaaand it runs again!  Not properly mind as it will only start with full throttle and still cuts out but at least it's running again which is a relief. 

Pp2k has given me some new information now it's starting again and perhaps most interestingly it's only got 70 bar of fuel rail pressure while cranking until you give it full throttle and it shoots upto almost 300 bar and starts.  Fuel pressure regulator sticking seems to be a good place to look?

[Ruan]

Where did the HP pump come from?

Have you got 12v to lift pump yet??

[ozonehostile]

Where did the HP pump come from?

Have you got 12v to lift pump yet??

The pump was off my spare hdi engine, removed from a car that was apparently running and driving about 3 weeks ago so I assumed (mistakenly) that the pressure regulator etc attached to it would be in good working order. 


And yes, with a new fuel filter I now have 12v to the lift pump

[Poodle]

What was the problem with the lift pump feed?

[Paul_13]

Cleaned the lift pump out?

[ozonehostile]

What was the problem with the lift pump feed?

I'm still not sure tbh, I've changed the pump relay and checked all the connections under the dash and that seems to have solved that for now. 

I cleaned the pump the first time it started playing up, a little bit of gunk in the strainer but not the worst I've seen

---

What was the problem with the lift pump feed?

I'm still not sure tbh, I've changed the pump relay and checked all the connections under the dash and that seems to have solved that for now. 

I cleaned the pump the first time it started playing up, a little bit of gunk in the strainer but not the worst I've seen

[powerandtorque]

I used to get similar lift pump supply voltage issues on my old 306 - issue was that one of the high-current terminals on the relay socket itself had got very hot to the point that it was black, and randomly it would result in a lousy connection, low-voltage at the pump and a non-start.

Simply removing and reseating the relay would fix it 9 times out of 10 and the car would then usually go months without missing a beat, only to randomly fail to start again one day. Never cut out once it had started though in the 100k miles I owned it.

Looking at the mountain of history that came with the car it had numerous relays and lift pumps fitted to try and fix the resulting symptoms, but evidentially the (mostly Peugeot dealer) mechanics had never spotted the relay socket itself was the underlying issue.

[ozonehostile]

Investigating my fuel pressure regulator problem further resulted in finding this:


Certainly explains why it didn't run properly! 

Starts first piston up with functioning regulator now in place, and tomorrow I'll see if it still cuts out under load, but fingers crossed this is the end of my problems with it :

Moral of the story, if a peg member tells you that the engine the hp pump was off was running a few days before, call bullshit!