t2 turbo

[Matty]

best bet would be a newer design turbo. Money is the limit as per usual with these things

[padge]

Seriously, put a t25 on and drive it, it's not even bad :/

[silverzx]

As far as the standard cars go..

For drive-ability and economy: GT15, Bosch, HDi box.
For power: T2, Bosch, XUD box.

I had a GT15'd Lucas on XUD ratios off DumDum and it felt very nippy. On full boost by under 1800RPM at 20PSI all the way up to 4,200. On a modded bosch I presume it would be even better!

[mark_airey]

i want no lag but power like a t25, i am in dream land and i know it but i still want it lol.

Sounds like what you are looking for is a super charger and not a turbo more like, I have a TD04 and there is very little difference in lag between the T2 I had on before that so just man up

to solve the low end issue just change down before you overtake and get it up on boost :mrgreen:

[Midnightclub]

i want no lag but power like a t25, i am in dream land and i know it but i still want it lol.

Sounds like what you are looking for is a super charger and not a turbo more like, I have a TD04 and there is very little difference in lag between the T2 I had on before that so just man up

to solve the low end issue just change down before you overtake and get it up on boost :mrgreen:

orrrr.... get a newer GT series turbo

[mark_airey]

Yeah but my TD04 was £35..............................

[Midnightclub]

I didn't say they were cheap lol

[liam doidge]

what gt turbo though? anyone got a list of all the gt turbos made so i can do a bit of research all i know is gt15 gt17 and gt20

[hbomb1905]

T2 ftw! Need a bit oflag or its just not fun! Might as well buy a 1.9 D!

[studturbo]

get rid of the gt15 i have one on my car killed it after 2weeks on it on car t2 alot better turbo

[Midnightclub]

what gt turbo though? anyone got a list of all the gt turbos made so i can do a bit of research all i know is gt15 gt17 and gt20

Keep an eye out for a GT2052s

[liam doidge]

cheers

[Dave]

If your considering putting a k03 or gt15 on over a t2 that's just rediculous, there's barely any lag difference in it and the t2 just such a more reliable turbo. You haven't experienced real lag where your not making any boost until after 4k then it gets silly. T2 all the way for drivability, and t25 if you can be bothered to get it to fit... Any turbo bigger than the stock one makes these things so much better for power but stock t2 still offered loads of low down punch and is virtually lagless through the gears once your in the right rev band.

[londondan86]

If your considering putting a k03 or gt15 on over a t2 that's just rediculous, there's barely any lag difference in it and the t2 just such a more reliable turbo. You haven't experienced real lag where your not making any boost until after 4k then it gets silly. T2 all the way for drivability, and t25 if you can be bothered to get it to fit... Any turbo bigger than the stock one makes these things so much better for power but stock t2 still offered loads of low down punch and is virtually lagless through the gears once your in the right rev band.

^ This man is talking sense!

[Jarrus]

Depends on what bhp you want, I reaserched this heavily ages ago,

I worked out that the VE of a typical XUD9TE is 76% which is rather low,

If you are wanting a maximum of 180 hp then a GT2052 would be nice to go for after that and over 200 then you want a GT2056, Landrover TD5's have a wastegated 2052 so take a look for one there

[Jarrus]

If your considering putting a k03 or gt15 on over a t2 that's just rediculous, there's barely any lag difference in it and the t2 just such a more reliable turbo. You haven't experienced real lag where your not making any boost until after 4k then it gets silly. T2 all the way for drivability, and t25 if you can be bothered to get it to fit... Any turbo bigger than the stock one makes these things so much better for power but stock t2 still offered loads of low down punch and is virtually lagless through the gears once your in the right rev band.

Had a gt2560r on my 1.9 and it was horrific! Full boost at 3600 rpms!?!... Was aweful lag but would make a great primary in a compound setup

[padge]

Gt2860rs apparently will make peak boost at 3200-3300 though??

[n0v0s]

Any experiences with a t3/t4 hybrid or t28?

[padge]

Straight T28 takes the piss, peak boost about 3800 lol.

[n0v0s]

But should reach a theoretical 200bhp right as i'm guessing a t25 / td04 would struggle to efficiently?

I know this sounds dodge, but i'm starting to prefer a laggy, lairy delivery that punches when on boost rather than a smooth, progressive type :? More fun!

[padge]

T25 is like that though, i haven't turned my fuel up yet, as i turned it way down due to a boost leak, hence the head swap, and it lags then BOOM! in yo face.

[n0v0s]

Sounds quality!

Mmh t28 with a .60 trim ...

[Jarrus]

Too laggy really to make the car any faster, my old turbo was called a t28bb gt2560r, it in fact made the car slower, because when you changed up, it would drop out of the boost threshold,

Ideal turbo is a gt2056... Nothing is better for making power on the standard XUD9TE
Its compressor map can provide lots of.boost without loads of air...just what we want really,

[n0v0s]

mmh yes Ruan mentioned this before...Think he said it could flow enough for ~200bhp??

You mean it can flow more air for lower boost levels (it's flow we want remember, boost is a measure of resistance)

How does the gt2056 compressor map compare to a td04/t25 map? (haven't got access to my laptop)

[Flynn]

At the end of the day you aren't going to make 200 horsepower without chucking a rod sooner or later and you said you need the car for uni so forget it.

[Jarrus]

Yes and no really, our engine have a relatively low VE about 76% I calculated at, and since we aren't making monster amounts of power then we don't need mega amounts of air, and because we aren't making peak power at 6 or 7 k rpms so we need more torque to make up for the lack of revs and engines that make power at lower RPMS need more boost pressure because were are making peak power at 4 or 5k rpms.

this is the compressor map for the TD04L-13g that's commonly found on Impreza WRX's (what year I don't know..) that we tend to use....

From looking at that compressor map, the maximum amount of boost that compressor is designed to run is about 25 psi, which is plenty for most people and maximum flow is about 280 hp worth of air which way more than we would need on a standard engine, and obviously you can run less than that....

Now lets have a look at the GT2056's....

Again just looking at the compressor map, the maximum boost that this turbo is designed is around 37 psi, which is an extra 12 psi! granted it is at the very top of the compressor map and our plot might not end up there but it just give you and idea of what we potencially have to play with.... as for maximum flow, it's around 240 hp worth of air which again is less than we would probably require.

The point being, on the GT2056 there's more room for when we do want mega amounts of power and on the TD04 there isn't due to the fact that it won't make the same boost levels as the GT2056.

[n0v0s]

Yes and no really, our engine have a relatively low VE about 76% I calculated at, and since we aren't making monster amounts of power then we don't need mega amounts of air, and because we aren't making peak power at 6 or 7 k rpms so we need more torque to make up for the lack of revs and engines that make power at lower RPMS need more boost pressure because were are making peak power at 4 or 5k rpms.

this is the compressor map for the TD04L-13g that's commonly found on Impreza WRX's (what year I don't know..) that we tend to use....

From looking at that compressor map, the maximum amount of boost that compressor is designed to run is about 25 psi, which is plenty for most people and maximum flow is about 280 hp worth of air which way more than we would need on a standard engine, and obviously you can run less than that....

Now lets have a look at the GT2056's....

Again just looking at the compressor map, the maximum boost that this turbo is designed is around 37 psi, which is an extra 12 psi! granted it is at the very top of the compressor map and our plot might not end up there but it just give you and idea of what we potencially have to play with.... as for maximum flow, it's around 240 hp worth of air which again is less than we would probably require.

The point being, on the GT2056 there's more room for when we do want mega amounts of power and on the TD04 there isn't due to the fact that it won't make the same boost levels as the GT2056.

Jarrus, thanks for taking the time to explain that. When you say 280bhp/240bhp - is that a calc for the XUD? Or is it modelled on a petrol example? As i was under the impression that a diesel requires ~50/60% more airflow in general for similiar power.

So if i understand you correctly, you are saying that the boost pressure (in the case of a lev reving diesel) is more important for helping to generate the low down characteristic torque we have? Thus emphasis should be placed upon a turbo that i capable of supporting greater boost levels rather than outright flow/cfm - which in turn will give best torque rather than outright peak psi?

Surely a gt2056 is going to chuck rods awol then? Is the XUD capable of generating the low down torque though with the relatively low injection pressures of an IDI? In terms of spool, would you say the td04/gt2056 would display similiar characterstics?

So to sum up, if a gt2056 was strapped to an XUD and cranked up to the limits of around 37psi, it would make for quite a :dance: ? haha

[n0v0s]

At the end of the day you aren't going to make 200 horsepower without chucking a rod sooner or later and you said you need the car for uni so forget it.

I am intending to fit HDi rods and balance the bottom end and lop off a bit of compression to help reduce that from happening. Although you are right, i just wanted to strap on a turbo capable of flowing that much and run less power, this way i thought i could prevent blowing up the turbo as it would be runing less stressed.

[Jarrus]

Pretty much sums it up, also those flow rating are according to the manufacture, you can make more or less on that but that's kind of a kind line figure,

A wastegated GT2056 should spool more quickly than a TD04 or a T25 but maybe not as quick as any of the OEM fit XUD turbos.

What you have to remember is that power is a product of torque and revs, to make 200 hp at 4000 rpms you need more torque than and engine making 200hp at 6000 rpms, be it diesel or petrol at there respective peak power.

To understand what I've said here is the formula....

power= torque*rpms/5252

Why 5252? well if you look on any power graphs thats the point where the 2 lines meet, on any graph...
so lets say, you want 200 hp at 4000 rpms, so we can use another of those formulas to find out how much torque you would need to make 200 hp at 4000 rpms as follows...

torque= power*5252/RPMS so....

200*5252/4000 = 262.6 lbft....

what if we want more revs like I said before.... 6000 rpms

200*5252/6000 = 175.1~ lbft...

make sence? because you are reving the engine higher you need less torque..... just take a look at the honda vtec engines, they produce lots of power for there size but not a lot of torque because they make there power through revs, we need torque to make the power we want.

hope this explains, and my apollogises in advance if I at all seemed patronising.

[Ruan]

These engines will produce good torque, not quite like a DI, but they will produce more than enough for our needs, the key with these engines is getting the fuel in past 4000rpm... You can strap on big blowers, but when they only start coming on strong past 3000rpm, you've got 1000rpm to play with...

The ENGINE will rev happily, but getting the fuel pump to play ball is the fun part!

Also, out of interest, where did you get the 78%VE figure from, Jarrus, I'd always seen much higher figures quoted for these engines - the 8v head as stock flows very well - and being an IDI, you're not worried about swirling, so you've not got to worry about the valves doing the swirling for you - just make them pass as much air as physically possible.