spring options for road rally / track day Xsara

[budd]

I'm currently continuing the developement of a Xsara VTS in which I compete in road rallies (see my newebie post for a little more info) the car as been built with budget been high on the prioities list, so much so that when it came to uprating the suspension I simply chopped a coil from the std srings well one was broken anyway so all I did was even them up, anyway after several events it's become obvious that this bodge isn't cutting it, what I'm looking for is a pr of coil springs that can cope with the rough and tumble of mixrd surface road on rallies but also be suitable for use on track,
A quick over view of the current suspension is as follows
cut down std springs, Koni adjustable struts
rear beam lowered 1 notch, solid rear beam mounts, std rear dampers,

I'm planning on overhauling the whole suspension in due course, although the beam was serviced when the beam was lowered and solid bushes fitted I plan to uprated the rear dampers , bushes etc and I'm told using 306 lower ball jionts and driveshafts will increase neg camber so that will be n the cards to but in the first instance I want to get the front springs sorted, I've been in touch with Skip Brown who have some dedicated 'night rally' spec springs but before I commit to these I looking for any suggestions, experiences etc thay my help me find the most appropriate opton, any advice gratefully received

[zx_volcane]

What's the difference in track width between this and a 306?

I fitted a 306 bottom arm to my zx by mistake and the increase in camber was ridiculous, wheel rubbed inner arch, and wheels were on the horizontal side :p

[budd]

I think the actual arms (306 > Xsara )are the same and it's the lower ball joint that differs been slightly longer and this moves the bottom of the hub/strut assembly outwards creating more camber I believe the mod also requires 306 driveshafts which are also slightly longer, although I'm not looking for as much camber as you appear to have had a couple of degrees will be fine

[zx_volcane]

Yeah difference is in the bottom ball joint, unfortunately this was one was riveted in

[Jonny81191]

You're a brave, brave man running cut springs on a rally car

Eibach springs are generally accepted to be a good compromise between performance and budget, you'll find a lot of people run them on their daily cars.

[budd]

[quote='Jonny81191' pid='339380' dateline='1381340981']
You're a brave, brave man running cut springs on a rally car

Eibach springs are generally accepted to be a good compromise between performance and budget, you'll find a lot of people run them on their daily cars.
e]

Yeah I know it's a bodge but I had no experience of where we needed to be re set up so given I had one spring with the lower coil snapped off I simply matched the pair by chopping a coil off the other it was only ever going to be a temp measure and now I know I need 'more spring it's just which to go far eibach are a quality item so they are certainly on the possible list but im really after some feedback on the skip brown springs which come highly recommended but I've no experience with them

[John1.4]

bilstein do dampers aimed at rally / motorsport don't they? i know they aren't the cheapest but certainly worth it in the long run.. then just match them up with some eibach springs as above...

[budd]

bilstein do dampers aimed at rally / motorsport don't they? i know they aren't the cheapest but certainly worth it in the long run.. then just match them up with some eibach springs as above...

we have Koni adjustables on at the moment and while I accept Bilstein are some of the best available but I don't think the improvement would justify ditching the Konis, the plan is to retain the Konis with a suitable spring, Eibach & Skip Brown been favourites at the moment, the idea is to get the strut assemblies sorted, damping set to suit the springs, new strut top bearings (current ones are destroyed) then test, it may be necessary to alter the rear ride height to suit the springs but I won't know till the springs are done, I suppose it's a case of trial and error but I'm pretty sure the best way to the optimum set up (with what I already have) is to start with the springs and work from there.

BTW do the strut bearings generally cause problems? when I fitted the dampers a few months ago they were fine, now after a few hundred road miles and 4 events (around 600 cmpetitive miles) the are notchy, the springs are twanging etc all signs that the strut top bearings are toast, I'll fit new when I replace the springs but can I expect to be replacing these bearings regularly ?

[Rippthrough]

If you've cut the springs, they won't be seating properly, which has probably fkd the top bearings due to the slip and side loadings.

[budd]

If you've cut the springs, they won't be seating properly, which has probably fkd the top bearings due to the slip and side loadings.

your right that won't have helped, hopefully new (proper springs ) and some more strut bearing will solve the issue

[budd]

Being having a think about my options re front suspension, in a perfect world (money no object) I’d be looking at coilovers from Ohlins ,AST et al , unfortunately money is a major consideration so realistically I’m looking for a low budget solution the most obvious candidate is a set of coil springs, Skip brown do a set of night rally springs for approx £100 delivered perfect for night rallies but they will lift the front end a little while this is OK for the lanes it’s not ideal for track use, Eibach do a lowering spring that would work well on the track but less so on the Rally events, what I need is a coilover with a stiffer spring that I can adjust for height as required but as stated previously I don’t have the funds for a proper coilover solution, I’m not considering ‘cheap’ £200-300 kits as they are usually not only cheap but nasty to.
So is it possible to find a decent solution on a budget of say £200? Well it just maybe, Peter Lloyd Rallying and Rally Designs do a coilover conversion kit (£30 each,) which is essentially some threaded tube and some locking rings, the idea is you chop off the OE style damper seat slide on the threaded tube and attach combine this with a 2 ¼” diameter spring (£15 each) of choice and et voila budget coilovers for under £100, OK it may not be that simple but it’s got to be worth looking into.
We were supposed to be doing a another Rally Nov 2rd and I was hoping the suspension would survive as is till after this but it really is on it’s last legs so I’ve decided not to enter the event and sort the suspension instead, then there’s no rush to get it ready within a couple of weeks.
The plan is to strip off all the front suspension this weekend evaluate it’s condition and list all the parts that are worn, broken and need replacement then do some measuring to see if the coilover conversion is indeed feasible, if it is then I cold end up with a decent quality adjustable damper (Koni) mated to a 2 ¼ coil spring that is height adjustable and with coil springs costing only around £15 it will be possible to experiment with alternative spring rates and lengths, well that’s the plan any thoughts ?