9-5 Aero vs V50 T5 AWD

[Kezzieboy]

So I've whittled my short-list of next cars down to two, it's either a V50 T5 or a 9-5 Aero.

I've read up on all their foibles, as well as potential avenues for tuning a year or two down the line, and I'm having trouble choosing between them (not to mention generally getting cold feet over buying a car/spending £2500!).

I've viewed one of each today, as follow:

V50 T5 AWD

9-5 Aero

Both cars seem solid, with good history, both have been very recently serviced. They are very different beasts, and in reality I'm not likely to buy this particular 9-5 because of the modifications bumping the insurance price up by a mile, however the comparison is still somewhat valid. Both have given me a number they actually want for the car, £2500 for the Volvo, £2000 for the Saab.

Whatever car I buy, it'll probably sit off the road for a month or two while I get the 306 sorted, but both are near enough to drive back on the current owners insurance/tax before transferring all the docs etc. Both are turbo petrols with over 200bhp. Both are around £400-£500 to insure, both will do nearly 40MPG if driven carefully, and less than 20 if not. The Volvo is an Auto (geartronic), but so are the vast majority of the Saabs I've seen for sale, and most of the cars in this segment in general, for that matter.

Just wondering if anyone has any reason in particular to choose one or the other, or NOT to choose one or the other.

Finally, how do you lot chop and change cars so frequently without it costing you a fortune, especially modified ones?! Insurance is giving me headaches, but I can take the hit as I'll have the car for a while, and I guess if you're just swapping standard cars insurers are a little more understanding? So if I decide I don't want it, it'll be easier to change?


Anyway, yeah, halp!?

[Toms306]

Turbo petrols really aren't my area but I'd have the Volvo out of those two...

Re insurance - you're changing a crappy old Peugeot diesel for a high performance petrol cruiser....there is likely to be an increase. My insurance on the Focus is £270 this year btw. Got a refund to swap it from the slightly modded HDi last year.

Oh, and you won't get 40mpg out of either of them....you just wont.

[Iceman299]

Why not go for diesel options? 

[Choppin]

Saab all day long!! But then I'm a lil biased as my family has had 3 of them haha and I agree with Toms306, you won't see 40mpg in the real world unless you only sit on the motorways

[Niall]

Yeah 40 is not realistic from a 95 aero. Try 35 at very best!
Personally, I'd have the Saab but I'm biased lol

[Kezzieboy]

Turbo petrols really aren't my area but I'd have the Volvo out of those two...

Re insurance - you're changing a crappy old Peugeot diesel for a high performance petrol cruiser....there is likely to be an increase. My insurance on the Focus is £270 this year btw. Got a refund to swap it from the slightly modded HDi last year.

Oh, and you won't get 40mpg out of either of them....you just wont.

Actually the insurance is the same, the issue isn't it getting more expensive, it's specialist insurers not being able to deal with a stock performance car. And you're talking to a man who got over 70MPG from a 306 HDi, you're clearly just shite at eco driving dude!

Why not go for diesel options? 

I have a diesel, I want a petrol. Simple as that! I can swap back if it's an issue, but I only do about 6k a year anyway.

Saab all day long!! But then I'm a lil biased as my family has had 3 of them haha and I agree with Toms306, you won't see 40mpg in the real world unless you only sit on the motorways

Again, I'm not expecting 40MPG average, just a possibility on a run to Cornwall that I'll get close.

Yeah 40 is not realistic from a 95 aero. Try 35 at very best!
Personally, I'd have the Saab but I'm biased lol

As above, and above that...

And yeah, I get what you see in them, they're awesome cars, and stupid cheap! The Volvo is lovely too, though.

[Dum-Dum]

Volvo, people are more likely to move out of the way on motorways or let you out of junctions if they suspect your an unmarked police car. Also 4wd will be useful occasionally and help getting all that power to the ground, especially if (when) you get it remapped.

[cpikey316_]

Saab! Just Saab

Im looking for another now!!

[adam b]

We get 38mpg out of our 9-5 aero estate at 70mph if you are careful and using 99 octane fuel. It has a stage 1 noobtune map on though.

I'd go Saab and i've had a P2 V70 T5. Problem with the volvos are if you have any issues. They aren't that reliable and getting someone to scan it (unless you are local or have the software) is an expensive option. The saab is considerably more simple, especially if you just buy a replacement ecu with a map on like we have. 3 minutes to swap out the ecu and it will live data read on the dash too so easy to find faults.

Saab needs to have the most recent PCV system (looks like thats been done) and regular oil changes. Volvo geartronic box isn't great and the esp systems are pretty intrusive for me. Unless that saab has had a 3" downpipe then it won't be 300BHp - find out who has done the mapping on it. If it has it will be 350lbft and genuinely rapid, feck all grip though.

If the volvo has 18" wheels (can't quite tell) then the tyres are a lot more money. Parts are a lot cheaper for the saab as most service items and brakes carry over to GM parts. There is a discount scheme through T5D5 for the volvo stuff from MRG chippenham though.

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My only issue with the saab is the capital letters in the advert...

[Ruan]

My opinion will be reasonably obvious...

Volvo for the fact that they are Focus based underneath, loads of parts available... Quite easy to essentially turn it into a Focus ST AWD estate with Volvo badge with a few part changes such as ARB, suspension settings etc... The engine is pure Focus ST and will take 99% of performance upgrades that are available for them...

Saab is still a Vectra underneath which isn't as good to drive, from my experience of the ESP system in my V50 , they're never going to be massively fun towards the limit, they're weighty cars, but at 8/10ths I'd prefer the V50 for the better steer.

That's just my bias though... I also think the V50 is the better looking car...

[Kezzieboy]

Volvo, people are more likely to move out of the way on motorways or let you out of junctions if they suspect your an unmarked police car. Also 4wd will be useful occasionally and help getting all that power to the ground, especially if (when) you get it remapped.

The 4WD is a cool feature and ridiculously rare, I feel like I'm getting a really good deal from the Volvo.

Saab! Just Saab

Im looking for another now!!

I do get it, they're lovely cars, but I dunno, the one I saw didn't jump out at me, maybe it was the owner that put me off


Thanks for all the info Adam, it's a noobtune map, but no downpipe, so he was a Billy bullshitter, was still rapid nonetheless

I think I need to see a tidy 04/05 model and see if that swings it for me, only thing is, that volvo won't be around forever. But getting a face lift model removes any PCV/Sludge worries as it was fixed from factory.

The cost of parts/repairs/servicing on the volvo is a bit scary, especially coming from a car in which you can replace the whole powertrain for under £100 lol. It has just been fully serviced though, including gearbox oil, which won't need doing again in my ownership.

It is rolling on 18s, but has a full set of almost new tyres, and they're sexy wheels!

That reminds me, I'll have a look at what specialists are about

[Dum-Dum]

Volvo for the fact that they are Focus based underneath, loads of parts available... Quite easy to essentially turn it into a Focus ST AWD estate with Volvo badge with a few part changes such as ARB, suspension settings etc... The engine is pure Focus ST and will take 99% of performance upgrades that are available for them...

Wrong way around mate, the Focus uses a de-tuned Volvo T5 lump but yeah there is loads of suspension parts about as well as a gazillion T5 tuning parts from the huge Scandinavian Volvo tuning scene and the ford scene. So yes it's like a practical Focus ST that you can own without looking like a yobbo

Volvo, people are more likely to move out of the way on motorways or let you out of junctions if they suspect your an unmarked police car. Also 4wd will be useful occasionally and help getting all that power to the ground, especially if (when) you get it remapped.

The 4WD is a cool feature and ridiculously rare, I feel like I'm getting a really good deal from the Volvo.

Yes I would mate. Just watch anyone with a FWD big power Saab or Volvo do a hard launch without being careful and it's all wheel spinning and no go. 4WD will make it faster in the real world as you can use more of the power more of the time.

[joshed]

Love saabs always look great but with saab going down the pan parts will soon become very hard to get, v50 is also a nice car would love one of them again. I see you predicament, I would go for saab but only because I had a V50 already

[Pete]

Volvo, purely for the 5 pot soundtrack.

[toseland]

V50 V50 V50 V50 V50...


nuff said..  


oh,  and that engine..  

[welshpug]

AWD V50 will be expensive when it goes wrong, and they do like to.

also you're carrying 150 kilos extra, for that one time a year you MIGHT have been better off with a 4x4, maybe, and that's a reasonable dent in the fuel economy.

as Adam said, SAAB parts wont be hard to get at all, they are making stuff again too.

[Niall]

I think people forget that car makers are obliged by a EU law that once the production of a car stops, they have to produce parts for it for 10 years after that date. Saab never disappeared completely. They just stopped producing cars and decreased in size massively! I have a Saab dealer near me that still advertises in their window funnily enough that they can still supply all parts needed. They just don't sell brand new Saabs any more. Mostly American shite now lol.

[Kezzieboy]

Opinions are quite divided then! I'm still undecided, swaying towards the ovlov, but wandering if I can live with the auto box on either...

[Niall]

My Saab had an auto box. If you read the Saab forums, a lot say the auto is actually better than the manual on that age 95 aero oddly! I only had it because i didnt have much choice. the car was very cheap at the time but it was spot on. Was great because you could be really comfy and laid back but bang it in sport mode (which does make a difference on these unlike a lot of cars) and it was off!

[Anton]

I think the Saab is a fair bit heavier than the Volvo.... I know the V50 will drive a lot better. Id definitely be choosing the Volvo.

[Dum-Dum]

You can't really claim that Volvo parts are expensive when they are mainly Ford parts now. I think even a few bits of bodywork and exhausts are cross compatible.

[welshpug]

the saab is more akin to a V70 not a V50, its much bigger, still uses less fuel though.

[adam b]

The V70 P2 is lighter than the 9-5, no idea on an awd v50.

Yeah great it's the focus st engine. Get it to Tim Williams asap to get the liners shimmed as they go pop a lot - they did change the design but not sure at what age. Or chuck in the better 2.4 lump 300bhp standard pretty much.

The 9-5 will be about 280bhp which is more than enough. Yeah awd is great off the line but it will hurt the mpg.

I'd still go Saab, but yeah I've missed the straight 5 noise (especially when the downpipe fell off...)

[Kezzieboy]

The size is one of the things that is swaying me towards the Volvo, as it's still versatile without being quite so big.

As far as I've read the liners will be absolutely fine as stock, apart from incredibly unusual cases! That's a point actually, 2 people have claimed the volvos are unreliable so far, but I've seen little evidence of it on the forums, really. On the other hand I only have 2 model years of 9-5 to choose from to avoid real risk of bottom end failure.

[adam b]

My earlier 2002 P2 v70 was completely awful... Join and ask on T5D5. One of the best forums going.

Pre 2002 9-5 should be avoided, update pcv and drop the sump on any others.

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The 300bhp 2.5 lumps have had loads of issues, guess the 225 or whatever version has less strain on it.

[Ruan]

Volvo for the fact that they are Focus based underneath, loads of parts available... Quite easy to essentially turn it into a Focus ST AWD estate with Volvo badge with a few part changes such as ARB, suspension settings etc... The engine is pure Focus ST and will take 99% of performance upgrades that are available for them...

Wrong way around mate, the Focus uses a de-tuned Volvo T5 lump but yeah there is loads of suspension parts about as well as a gazillion T5 tuning parts from the huge Scandinavian Volvo tuning scene and the ford scene. So yes it's like a practical Focus ST that you can own without looking like a yobbo

Lol I know, I'm just making the point that the RNC engine is the engine used in all Volvo P1/Ford C1 platform cars... There's quite a few differences to the original RN "Volvo T5".

You can't just plop in an RN engine into a car with the RNC mounts, from memory there's holes to be drilled... I.E. You can't put the late 2.4 T5 S60/V70 motor in that's ripe for tuning straight into a C30/V50/Focus ST shell... It sits differently in the engine bay, mounts differently... But all the Focus ST performance parts fit the V50/ST RNC engine fine since it's a Focus underneath.

The V50 AWD yes has more to go wrong, although there's SO much information as it was SO much more popular in the US and TBF I see very few problems with them... Parts aren't that expensive and I'd doubt will be any worse than Saab, from what I've seen the V50 appears to be pretty damned reliable, I've done 40k in mine and my parents have done the other 70k of the 120k it's done in it's 9-10 year life and other than one or two electrical gremlins about 5 years ago - the well documented Teves MK60 fault that affects Volvo/Ford/BMW/Saab/VW/Seat/Audi/Skoda/Mazda (i.e. a lot of cars) which was replaced under warranty, like most have - is sorted, it's really not put a foot wrong. Only items it seems to treat as consumable are wheel bearings, although these are not a press in item, the unit bolts with 4 bolts and drops out... Saab parts aren't hard to get hold of as they're mostly GM parts and any specific Saab parts will be held in stock for ages yet, I expect the price is elevated mind.

Unless you intend on a 350hp V50 T5 AWD which I wouldn't recommend due to the liners probably shitting - I'd be going with the V50.. The Saab probably will produce more power with less money spent... Also the 9-5 as said by others is a V70 competitor, not a V50 competitor... But as I said, Focus in a frock vs Vectra in a frock... I know which I'd choose! I'm biased as you all know, but then, I'm someone who easily gets bored and I've had mine for 18 months, done 40k in it and it's been ace and I still enjoy driving it.

[Dum-Dum]

Also from a driving point of view I've been told the saab is more likely to understeer whereas from personal experience the C30 and focus in FWD form both lift off oversteer making it more 306 like to drive.

[Anton]

As above, yes, yes they do lol. The V50 is the same

[Ruan]

As above, yes, yes they do lol. The V50 is the same

The ESP doesn't like it much unsurprisingly, I wouldn't say it'll hold DK/205gti levels of sideways, especially the ones with DSTC which has yaw sensors to detect such shenanigans... But needless to say, a slight lift will allow it to neutralise mid corner...

[Eeyore]

Its a bit of an odd choice in my opinion. if you are considering the V50 and that size suits you then why not look at the 9-3? You get a lot of car for the money and 250hp is enough.

James and I have got 9-3s. Aero is the top spec with 2.8 V6 Turbo. 250hp. 0-60 in 6.6. 25mpg if towing and 28mpg if motorway driving sensibly. Its great to drive. With the saabs you need to make sure you get the right spec. The sound systems often use fibreoptics and the brain is in the boot so you cant just swap it all like you usually would.

I had to make essentially the same choice as you. A v50 or a 9-3. I chose the 9-3 because it was more exciting, unique styling, loads of parts as its essentially a vectra C, and its a whole load of car for the money! If youve got any questions get in touch