I hate coal

[DeeTurbo]

Hi there,

I hope every one had a good Christmas.

At the moment I'm running a prosteve stage 1 map, rear mid box mod, egr and cat removed. I've had the map around 6 months now and love it.

The issue I'm having is when the car boosts over 12psi I get chronic coal and I feel it's embarrassing having that much smoke coming out.

So, I'm guessing it's because of the extra feuling from the map that's causing it. I read on Steve's HDI tuning group on FB that a R70 pump and a 1.6 HDI rail sensor can reduce it.

But if I'm going through the trouble to do that I might as well go stage 2 and fit an intercooler.

Now, I guess if I go stage 2 I could get the fueling dialed down on the map a little or get the boost increased so I don't get too much smoke. Is that right?

Do you get much smoke on a stage 2 normally under heavy load?

[Craigus]

So its smoking on boost?

[Toms306]

You shouldn't be getting much coal on boost tbh, have you got any boost leaks?

I had a PS stage 1 map and it was much less smoky than the whippy one, only really smoking off boost and right round near the limiter where boost was dropping off.


You're right about the stage 2 though, you raise the boost (manually) so you can up the fuel a bit more.

[Piggy]

Either boost needs increasing, you have a boost leak or perhaps a sensor is out

Shouldnt be coaling on boost like that

[Jimbo]

Faulty MAF meter can cause them to smoke

[DeeTurbo]

Hmmm, you got me thinking now because of the high milage I'm now starting to think I either have a boost leak or blow by on the pistons and I'm not getting enough compression in the cylinders?

I think there might be a slight boost leak as I can hear a bit of a funny sound under heavy acceleration, I'll see what I can find.

So its smoking on boost?

Yes, I'm getting smoke while on boost.

---

Faulty MAF meter can cause them to smoke

Yes, very true but it's a 7 month old OEM MAF and it's fine on the standard map.

[Toms306]

Check the boost pipe connection on the turbo....that one was leaking on the HDi's I had with half the mileage of yours lol!

[DeeTurbo]

When I was doing the EGR removal I did notice a bit of oil over the turbo. I thought it came from the top of the valve itself.



Do I check the two hose clips there?

[C2K]

Likely to be your maf is dead. Unplug it and see if it drives better. When my original went, the smoke was something James bond would have been proud of.

Have you disturbed anything recently?

[Ruan]

Those pipes aren't original off the turbo... Make sure they're not leaking, I'd guess they are!!

Remember the maf will be telling the ECU that there's more air going into the engine than reality if its leaking... The maps are pretty well calibrated as far as MAF goes...

[Sambarker]

Every tuned hdi I've had has smoked well on boost

[Toms306]

Those pipes aren't original off the turbo... Make sure they're not leaking, I'd guess they are!!

Looks original to me! But Dee's had the car from new so can confirm if they've been changed.

That short silicone will almost certainly be leaking though, the jubilee clips weaken, and then you strip them trying to tighten them if you're a heavy handed prat like me... You could clean up the area and check where any fresh oil comes from to be sure though, or use the soapy water method to check for leaks.

[Dum-Dum]

An R70 pump and 1800bar rail sensor wont fix anything

Your MAF can be gone at 7 months, especially if its a non pug air filter.

Those boost pipes off the turbo look like they are leaking and if you are only getting 12 psi probably are considering the car should run 14-15 standard and 15-16 mapped.

[DeeTurbo]

Likely to be your maf is dead. Unplug it and see if it drives better. When my original went, the smoke was something James bond would have been proud of.

Have you disturbed anything recently?

Thanks but the MAF is fine. I've tied unplugging it and swapping it with one off my girlfriends 206 and it made no difference.

Those pipes aren't original off the turbo... Make sure they're not leaking, I'd guess they are!!

Remember the maf will be telling the ECU that there's more air going into the engine than reality if its leaking... The maps are pretty well calibrated as far as MAF goes...

Yep, pipes are original. Here's a better pic.

Those pipes aren't original off the turbo... Make sure they're not leaking, I'd guess they are!!

Looks original to me! But Dee's had the car from new so can confirm if they've been changed.

That short silicone will almost certainly be leaking though, the jubilee clips weaken, and then you strip them trying to tighten them if you're a heavy handed prat like me... You could clean up the area and check where any fresh oil comes from to be sure though, or use the soapy water method to check for leaks.

So, your saying the boost leak is from the joint rather than a split? I'll replace the clips with better quality Mikalor ones. Do you know what size clips I need. Servicebox say 50-70mm.

I thought the oil was coming from here.

An R70 pump and 1800bar rail sensor wont fix anything

Your MAF can be gone at 7 months, especially if its a non pug air filter.

Those boost pipes off the turbo look like they are leaking and if you are only getting 12 psi probably are considering the car should run 14-15 standard and 15-16 mapped.

I think it's boosting to around 16PSI but over 12PSI it starts to smoke. It's a genuine pug air filter. I've always bought genuine filters as I feel I'm saving on labour doing the work myself there no reason I should skimp on parts.

[Toms306]

Those pipes aren't original off the turbo... Make sure they're not leaking, I'd guess they are!!

Looks original to me! But Dee's had the car from new so can confirm if they've been changed.

That short silicone will almost certainly be leaking though, the jubilee clips weaken, and then you strip them trying to tighten them if you're a heavy handed prat like me... You could clean up the area and check where any fresh oil comes from to be sure though, or use the soapy water method to check for leaks.

So, your saying the boost leak is from the joint rather than a split? I'll replace the clips with better quality Mikalor ones. Do you know what size clips I need. Servicebox say 50-70mm.

I thought the oil was coming from here.

Yeah, most likely leaking at the joint, don't think I've ever seen a standard boost pipe split on a 306 HDi tbh. I don't know the exact size unfortunately, and Mikalors only have a very small tolerance, someone else may know though.

That EGR certainly won't have helped though, haven't seen one that bad before! Thats probably contributed to the mess so I'd check that the pipe is leaking with soapy water before spending out on new clamps. There is also another short silicone connection at the top of the plastic pipe to check, I don't think that's really accessible though but cant remember.

[DeeTurbo]

The top looks nice and clean.



Bloody servicebox doesn't say the size of the pipe sleeve the turbo end but it does the top end.

Yeah, the Mikalors only have around 4mm adjustment.

[Poodle]

What map did you get from Steve? I believe he hands out full power maps as standard, which will smoke a bit, unless specifically asked for something different.

[DeeTurbo]

What map did you get from Steve? I believe he hands out full power maps as standard, which will smoke a bit, unless specifically asked for something different.

I just asked for a stage one with EGR deleted and I told him the mods that I had done.

Do you know what size the OD of the pipe that goes on the exit of the turbo is?

[mad306man]

I have identical mods to you on my hdi, and a stage 1 pro Steve map.
Smoke levels are very subjective, can you get a vid of yours and I can tell you if its any worse/better than mine?

[DeeTurbo]

I was thinking of doing a video. I'll try and sort something out.

[Poodle]

Fair enough, yeah a video would be helpful.

It does look like there could be a boost leak there tbf, have you tried the soapy water trick yet?

Might have a spare pipe in my garage, will go and measure it now.

---

Couldn't find a joiner, but the turbo exit is 43mm. The silicone won't be much more than a mm thick, so probably ~46mm OD.

[DeeTurbo]

Bugger, it got dark before I could get ready to go out.

I'll try and get one done tomorrow.

Any luck with that spare pipe Poodle?

[Poodle]

Ah sorry, updated ^^^.

[DeeTurbo]

I think I'll replace with these for peace of mind and then report back.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mikalor-W2-Sta...89621dfa2f

Thanks for your help guys.

[Ruan]

Don't try and get Mikalors in there - they aren't that good at all, I don't know where the whole Mikalor thing came from, they're not better!

Get a pair of Hi-Torq or Hi-Grip Jubilees for it, they're smaller, are actually adjustable and will apply way more force where it's needed than Mikalors - also they're significantly easier to install.

Mikalors tend to only really work if they're exactly the right size for the job - they're also a proper shit to install.

[DeeTurbo]

Don't try and get Mikalors in there - they aren't that good at all, I don't know where the whole Mikalor thing came from, they're not better!

Get a pair of Hi-Torq or Hi-Grip Jubilees for it, they're smaller, are actually adjustable and will apply way more force where it's needed than Mikalors - also they're significantly easier to install.

Mikalors tend to only really work if they're exactly the right size for the job - they're also a proper shit to install.

Thanks I'll try them instead. I've used Mikalors at work and thought them to be good and allow more clamping force but yes it would be a pain to fit them there as it's a bit of a tight spot.

Bit of an update on this. I tried filming the issue the other day only to find I couldn't get it to happen again. I'm still going to replace the hose clips and clean up the area.

[Poodle]

So it's an intermittent issue..?

Is it definitely boost-related, rather than engine speed, for example?

[DeeTurbo]

I do get more smoke when the car is boosting over 12 psi at whatever rpm I'm at. So I'm guessing that would mean boost leak?

I've ordered some Hi-Grip hose clips http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/350869286865?s...1439.l2649

So, I'll see what happens when they're installed.

[Poodle]

Fair enough, certainly sounds that way, seems odd you couldn't make it happen to film though... Were you revving it while stationery by any chance?

Fingers crossed the new jubilees fix it.

[DeeTurbo]

No, I tried it under load while driving. The only thing I can think of that might have had an effect is that it was a very cold day when I tried to make it smoke again, ie denser air perhaps?