New Conservative driving proposals

[Toms306]

Better common sense applied.

/thread

This needs to be implemented everywhere, not just driving. Unfortunately it seems it's not something that can be taught.

[306Puggy]

puggy stop wasting thread space. its boring and takes ages to scroll past.

the issue is young kids shouldnt need to die and when they have accidents they end up killing their mates and innocent victims in the process.

---

Better training.
Better tests.
Better common sense applied.

/thread

Tell Niall that piglet, not me. The test and training are perfectly adequate. Stop being daft. /thread.

[ginge191]

TBH if you need to spread your posts across pages to make a point, you're doing something wrong.

Big words don't make you clever.

Piggy has the point; common sense is a must

[cwspellowe]

Brilliant, more Puggy bashing for no apparent reason. Keeping everyone's insults to themselves, and back on topic before certain people fish for a reaction..

Can't say I disagree with the Tory proposals. Won't affect any of us, times change, as will the tests and training required to drive a car. I know plenty of young people who have written off cars, doesn't mean they were at fault though. You get some retarded young drivers yeah, but the majority just need experience, the 100 hours thing seems like a good idea to me. Maybe not the curfew, that's ridiculous, but introduce motorway driving and minimum hours to the curriculum and I can't see it being a bad thing.

[Piggy]

The test and training are perfectly adequate. Stop being daft. /thread.

I assume you are joking??!

if not....then clearly you dont mind young people killing themselves and others because they can fluke a easy driving test with doing a couple of hours and learning the tricks.

I never told any of my students but its not difficult the test and recent changes to it have made it even easier.

If you got lucky you could end up doing no more than 30mph, doing a turn in the road and not doing a hill start or an emergency stop. and only spending 30min out.

then you get to drive anywhere you like and with enough money any car you want.

yeah thats not daft at all

[Niall]

Maybe if you looked past the end of your nose, you would realise that yes most people will agree with you when saying if young idiots want to kill them selves then so be it but what about the other people they harm? What about the old woman they kill when they mount the pavement because they think they can drive fast? What about the guy on his way to work who ends up trapped in his car because some idiotic young driver has smashed him into a tree?
Yes, it probably would be good if some of these young people hurt them selves. Thats called natural selection. Hopefully a process that will find you and people like you soon enough.

Why would natural selection "find me"? I am the opposite of said young drivers I know you don't like me (don't worry it's mutual) but that's somewhat harsh But yeah I was referring to the "yoofs" who crash into inanimate objects, not who run people over and generally maim.

Anyway, there are two issues here. First is, people at 17 are not mature enough to take full responsibility of their actions on the road. Thats not something that can be taught. Thats just something that comes with getting older. The second is the level of instruction and testing before you can use the roads. We have one of the easiest driving tests in Europe and yet we also have some of the most congested roads in Europe. IMO, a recipe for disaster which we are heading for. Clearly your not one of these people that can take responsibility for their actions on the road otherwise you wouldn't be scared of the thought of an extended driving test. Its people like you that drive like morons and keep everyones insurance premiums high.
Oh and driving on the motorway might seem easy but clearly its not for the majority. I spend most of my days on motorways and the levels of stupidity from people, old, young and everything in between is quite frankly ridiculous.

You are making a blanket statement about maturity at 17, you don't have any real evidence apart from anecdotal evidence from your experiences and others' experiences. Which is your own fault if you drove like an idiot when you were 17 or 18.

Yes your right i am making a blanket statement. There is exceptions to this statement but generally, 17 year olds are not as mature as they think they are and im sure most will realise they were guilty of that when they look back.
I do have evidence. as Kent quite rightly said, its quite a well known statistic that 8/10 will crash their car in their first year which is going to be down to two things. Immaturity (being pressured by mates in a car to do stupid things) and lack of experience. Both of which can be changed by introducing more teaching, testing and potentially a curfew or similar.

Secondly, I think the driving test is hard for the wrong reasons. For instance, why do you fail if you touch the kerb on reversing round the corner? How stupid is that?

How stupid is that? How stupid are you? If you cant perform a simple manoeuvre at a slow speed, your not prepared to be controlling over a ton of metal at high speed.

And secondly, why would I be afraid of an extended driving test? I passed my driving test years ago, these new rules wouldn't even effect me, I am condemning these rules purely because they are stupid, not for selfish reasons, I'm not short sighted.

Thirdly, please explain how I keep people's insurance premiums high. I am an Advanced driver and practise safe advanced techniques on the road when I drive. So are you saying that advanced driving techniques are "moronic"? If not then please explain how this makes premiums high

Perhaps if you wait until your mouth has stopped frothing before you make a post next time your argument would not be deconstructed with such ease

Oh, I will ignore your quite frankly unprofessional ban hammer threat by the way (because you are losing the argument), I've given you quite enough to deal with as it is!

Perhaps if you actually consider what you are saying before posting, you might realise how moronic you sound 99% of the time. I do understand you get your kicks from winding people up but quite frankly, your poor at it. At least if your going to do a job, do it properly.
And there is no unprofessional use of the ban hammer. I have had this conversation with you time and time again about your sick and twisted fantasies. Other people dont want to hear it and ive also warned you that if you carry on, i will ban you.

Please grow up Yashar!

[welshpete]

in two hours you cant show someone how to deal with all roads and traffic situations...no matter how able and skilled they are.

But I can quite happily counter that argument saying that in 10 years of driving and probably 150,000 miles I haven't encountered every situation and I still learn things when I'm out on the road although yes most of my learning is done.

Passing your test is just a minimum standard to then be able to go out and start the real learning.

Gotta agree with DumDUM on this one. I am 50, passed my test at 16 whilst in the army, passed my hgv less than a year later, and been driving large and very large/oversize/weight vehicles all over the world since, done in excess of 2 million miles I should think, and I AM STILL learning....it never stops, and as the roads get more and more congested, driving styles MUST change to take account of this....But the curfew IS a daft idea...and as for no ne under 30....that then takes about half the cops off the road don't it?????

[Dum-Dum]

Piggy you bring me on to a very good subject with tests, people arent passed on the standard of their driving, Test Centers have a quota for the percentage of people they must pass every month.

and as for no ne under 30....that then takes about half the cops off the road don't it?????

LOL thats a very good point, can you imagine if you called the police as you were getting your head kicked in and were told that they couldn't come out to you as none of them were allowed to drive after 10pm. FLOL. Same would go for the ambulances too, most paramedics are under 30.

[Piggy]

and breakdown men, fire service, take aways, postal workers...
world would stop

[Dum-Dum]

and breakdown men, fire service, take aways, postal workers...
world would stop

Fire men and break down men not so much as alot are over 30 especially due to needing HGV licence.

Don't think Ive ever seen a take away rider over 30 though, no 2am pizza deliverys to work Also Id bet you then get a spike of people at 30 years old who suddenly go out and crash the first time they drive at night cos they have no experience of it.

[rtha6551]

My driving test in March this year consisted of pottering around no faster than 40mph and doing a turn in a road wide enough to fit a barge

[Dum-Dum]

My driving test in March this year consisted of pottering around no faster than 40mph and doing a turn in a road wide enough to fit a barge

LOL my turn in the road I found out on one of my lessons I could actually do it all forward without backing up and my instructor told me that if i got that route I'm my test I had to go back and forwards or they wouldn't pass me.

[rtha6551]

My driving test in March this year consisted of pottering around no faster than 40mph and doing a turn in a road wide enough to fit a barge

LOL my turn in the road I found out on one of my lessons I could actually do it all forward without backing up and my instructor told me that if i got that route I'm my test I had to go back and forwards or they wouldn't pass me.

The examiner would be fairly miffed I'm sure lol!

I also pulled the biggest wheelspin I can ever remember doing completely by accident on my test, steep junction and it was pouring it down as well, don't even know if she noticed it or not hahaha

[lolsteve]

From my experience 95% of the crashes/bumps/scraps etc would have been avoided with decent rubber on the cars

Motorway driving lessons wouldn't go amiss either, can admit was scared to tits the first time I went on one and one of the guys I live with first drove on a motorway about 2 years after passing his test. Was quite interesting/bumhole tightening being with him when he still wasn't confident on them

[Lolben91]

The current practical driving test is only suitable if all youre ever going to do is drive from home to the village shop.
I didnt have a clue what i was doing when i first went on a motorway, i just winged it.
Theres no emphasis on danger, none of this is illegal because..., this is the road speed because..., no accident avoidance training what so ever besides the emergency stop.
The test does need to cover more areas, motorway at the very least, but it did amaze me how i read in a paper a little while back that some people fail their test multiple times a year, surely after so many attempts someone should step in and tell them no, youre just not able to drive a car.
On my test i backed into the curb twice, but i dont think the guy even noticed! Maybe thought id just hit the brake a little harshly?

[rtha6551]

Its also worth remembering that there are worse drivers out there who have been passed years and are well over the age of 30 that are just as much of a risk if not more than many young drivers! The ones who behave anyway

You can be as safe and careful as you want but then youve got to look out for the other idiots on the road -.-

[Toms306]

I really don't see the problem with motorways? They're no different from dual carriageway A roads tbh. What exactly are people finding difficult about them?

I'd say you probably had a pretty poor teacher tbh Ben, some obviously just teach purely for the test. My instructor taught a lot of extra stuff....but then we had plenty of time due to where I live...wasted an hour every lesson on the same road as there's only one between my village and town lol.


And as for many tests, one of my mates from school passed on his 9th test.... But he'd been driving on private ground for years so was determined to pass eventually lol.

---

You can be as safe and careful as you want but then youve got to look out for the other idiots on the road -.-

This is THE biggest issue with driving. Operating a car isn't difficult. Negotiating roads/corners/spacial awareness isn't difficult. Whats difficult is judging what the other people are doing - a lot don't bother with indicators, a lot don't bother chosing a lane until the last minute where they dive across and expect you to let them in, several cant negotiate corners where theres two lanes of traffic in one direction again expecting you to brake to avoid scraping the side of their car and then you get the ~80% of people that can't understand give way lines and cut you up.... Oh and then theres always those that believe 30mph is perfectly reasonable for a national speed limit piece of road...so you go to overtake where its clear and they speed up.....only to slow down again immediately after! Other drivers are what ruins driving tbh, its much nicer at ~11pm when theres barely anyone on the road!

[Lolben91]

I wouldnt say my teacher was bad, i did pass first time, but in saying that he did only really teach me how to pass my test, which is what it seems like most instructors do. It was only when i first got my car that i actually learnt how to drive.
The problem with motorways to at least an new driver is that theres lots of fast moving and large vehicles, which can be quite unnerving to some especially when its their first time. I didnt have a problem getting to grips with how the motorways work, just with lane hoggers and lorries that get right up on your arse when in a 50 limited road works zone...
But i agree, other motorists ruin driving, forcing into gaps, dangerous over taking, not allowing over taking, cutting across carriageways to make an exit, repeatedly going the long way round roundabouts without indicating because theyre lost (happens often around the NEC iv found).
The proposals wont get in. Whats the point of selling a 5 seat car to someone if theyre not allowed to fill the other 4? Whats the point in putting in lanes for people who give colleagues a lift to work in certain areas? Whos going to work to buy a car that they then might not be able to use to get home at night? Whos going to monitor this logbook to make sure its not been blagged? Just another huff of wind from someone trying to make their job position seem not pointless.
If anything id like to see a BHP limit on cars like they do bikes, i imagine theres a lot less risk to others by someone coming off their scooter than someone having their license for a week and binning an evo

[306Puggy]

I really don't see the problem with motorways? They're no different from dual carriageway A roads tbh. What exactly are people finding difficult about them?

I'd say you probably had a pretty poor teacher tbh Ben, some obviously just teach purely for the test. My instructor taught a lot of extra stuff....but then we had plenty of time due to where I live...wasted an hour every lesson on the same road as there's only one between my village and town lol.


And as for many tests, one of my mates from school passed on his 9th test.... But he'd been driving on private ground for years so was determined to pass eventually lol.

---

You can be as safe and careful as you want but then youve got to look out for the other idiots on the road -.-

This is THE biggest issue with driving. Operating a car isn't difficult. Negotiating roads/corners/spacial awareness isn't difficult. Whats difficult is judging what the other people are doing - a lot don't bother with indicators, a lot don't bother chosing a lane until the last minute where they dive across and expect you to let them in, several cant negotiate corners where theres two lanes of traffic in one direction again expecting you to brake to avoid scraping the side of their car and then you get the ~80% of people that can't understand give way lines and cut you up.... Oh and then theres always those that believe 30mph is perfectly reasonable for a national speed limit piece of road...so you go to overtake where its clear and they speed up.....only to slow down again immediately after! Other drivers are what ruins driving tbh, its much nicer at ~11pm when theres barely anyone on the road!

I agree Tom, any complete and utter moron can drive on a motorway, just keep left and follow the car/truck in front FFS! Not friggin rocket science like some people are making out. They cover DCs which are just like motorways but actually more hazardous. Did you know there can be pedestrian crossings on DCs? Motorways are far easier than some dual carriageways which go into roundabouts and other hazards. There is some really stupid tripe being posted by certain people on here.

I wouldnt say my teacher was bad, i did pass first time, but in saying that he did only really teach me how to pass my test, which is what it seems like most instructors do. It was only when i first got my car that i actually learnt how to drive.
The problem with motorways to at least an new driver is that theres lots of fast moving and large vehicles, which can be quite unnerving to some especially when its their first time. I didnt have a problem getting to grips with how the motorways work, just with lane hoggers and lorries that get right up on your arse when in a 50 limited road works zone...
But i agree, other motorists ruin driving, forcing into gaps, dangerous over taking, not allowing over taking, cutting across carriageways to make an exit, repeatedly going the long way round roundabouts without indicating because theyre lost (happens often around the NEC iv found).
The proposals wont get in. Whats the point of selling a 5 seat car to someone if theyre not allowed to fill the other 4? Whats the point in putting in lanes for people who give colleagues a lift to work in certain areas? Whos going to work to buy a car that they then might not be able to use to get home at night? Whos going to monitor this logbook to make sure its not been blagged? Just another huff of wind from someone trying to make their job position seem not pointless.
If anything id like to see a BHP limit on cars like they do bikes, i imagine theres a lot less risk to others by someone coming off their scooter than someone having their license for a week and binning an evo

How many times do I have to explain this!? Insurance IS the BHP limit, FFS. There is no need for stupid laws to come in, it's already naturally taken car of.

[THE_Liam]

You can be as safe and careful as you want but then youve got to look out for the other idiots on the road -.-

This is THE biggest issue with driving. Operating a car isn't difficult. Negotiating roads/corners/spacial awareness isn't difficult. Whats difficult is judging what the other people are doing - a lot don't bother with indicators, a lot don't bother chosing a lane until the last minute where they dive across and expect you to let them in, several cant negotiate corners where theres two lanes of traffic in one direction again expecting you to brake to avoid scraping the side of their car and then you get the ~80% of people that can't understand give way lines and cut you up.... Oh and then theres always those that believe 30mph is perfectly reasonable for a national speed limit piece of road...so you go to overtake where its clear and they speed up.....only to slow down again immediately after! Other drivers are what ruins driving tbh, its much nicer at ~11pm when theres barely anyone on the road!

This is very true. I'd also like to add cyclists going through red lights, jumping on and off the pavement, weaving in and out of cars while traffic is moving off. Oh, and buses, who seem to think that they have an automatic right to pull away from the kerb 0.000023 of a second after indicating, whether it's clear or not...

[bigcheez2k3]

I wouldnt say my teacher was bad, i did pass first time, but in saying that he did only really teach me how to pass my test, which is what it seems like most instructors do. It was only when i first got my car that i actually learnt how to drive.
The problem with motorways to at least an new driver is that theres lots of fast moving and large vehicles, which can be quite unnerving to some especially when its their first time. I didnt have a problem getting to grips with how the motorways work, just with lane hoggers and lorries that get right up on your arse when in a 50 limited road works zone...
But i agree, other motorists ruin driving, forcing into gaps, dangerous over taking, not allowing over taking, cutting across carriageways to make an exit, repeatedly going the long way round roundabouts without indicating because theyre lost (happens often around the NEC iv found).
The proposals wont get in. Whats the point of selling a 5 seat car to someone if theyre not allowed to fill the other 4? Whats the point in putting in lanes for people who give colleagues a lift to work in certain areas? Whos going to work to buy a car that they then might not be able to use to get home at night? Whos going to monitor this logbook to make sure its not been blagged? Just another huff of wind from someone trying to make their job position seem not pointless.
If anything id like to see a BHP limit on cars like they do bikes, i imagine theres a lot less risk to others by someone coming off their scooter than someone having their license for a week and binning an evo

How many times do I have to explain this!? Insurance IS the BHP limit, FFS. There is no need for stupid laws to come in, it's already naturally taken car of.

Erm...no it's not. With enough money you can have whatever you want. I know a guy that has been driving for less than 2 years, he earns a decent wedge and still lives at home, meaning he's had a 3 series touring, 1 series, Focus ST and now an S13. Gets raped for insurance but he can pay it.

[Dum-Dum]

If anything id like to see a BHP limit on cars like they do bikes, i imagine theres a lot less risk to others by someone coming off their scooter than someone having their license for a week and binning an evo

How many times do I have to explain this!? Insurance IS the BHP limit, FFS. There is no need for stupid laws to come in, it's already naturally taken car of.

Puggy your wrong, its no bhp limit if you have loads of money or if you buy fast stuff thats rarely crashed also if you know what to look for you can have fast stuff cheap, this is why me and my mates had mondeos when we was younger.

My 3rd car was a 1.4 polo and I got a 1.4 as it was cheaper to insure than the smaller engined ones and the 1.6 would of only cost me another few quid.

Same with the fact it barely costs any more to insure a GTi6 compared to a DTurbo even though they have nearly twice the power.

[THE_Liam]

^^^ That's true, at 19 I had a Rover 420 GSI, 130bhp, leather, AC, cruise, and it was less to insure than the 1.2 Corsas my mates were knocking around in because it was an old man car. Looked and went well with 820 turbo wheels and all the chrome body-coloured though...

[C.A.R.]

Agree with a lot of what's being said - not with the proposal itself however.

I think there should be greater, more in-depth tuition. Motorways are something which should be included. The test should encourage people to have an even better understanding of how a car works too. I know you already have to locate the battery, coolant, oil, dipstick etc. but this is incredibly tame and blindingly f*cking obvious to anyone with two brain cells to rub together. I wouldn't expect anyone to be able to rebuild a car using a Haynes manual and a penknife, just to have a better understanding of what's what.

Kid at work has just passed his test, on the 2nd try (took me 3 attempts to be fair) but he's as thick as pig shit. He regularly brags that now he can break the speed limit and 'rag it' around town with his mates. Matter. Of. Time.

I think they should make these dash-cams mandatory. It would cut down on so many false whiplash claims the insurance would be dramatically reduced. Accidents which so often go 50/50 would now be able to be correctly identified as to who was at fault. They're cheap as f*ck and the Russians have been using them for years - they're usually 3 steps behind the rest of the developed world!

My Mrs is trying to pass her test again next year, which will mean re-sitting her theory test too. To be honest, last year when she was taking her test she wasn't really ready and it was both a pain in the ass and a relief when she didn't pass.

[kentiiboii]

If anything id like to see a BHP limit on cars like they do bikes, i imagine theres a lot less risk to others by someone coming off their scooter than someone having their license for a week and binning an evo

How many times do I have to explain this!? Insurance IS the BHP limit, FFS. There is no need for stupid laws to come in, it's already naturally taken car of.

Puggy your wrong, its no bhp limit if you have loads of money or if you buy fast stuff thats rarely crashed also if you know what to look for you can have fast stuff cheap, this is why me and my mates had mondeos when we was younger.

My 3rd car was a 1.4 polo and I got a 1.4 as it was cheaper to insure than the smaller engined ones and the 1.6 would of only cost me another few quid.

Same with the fact it barely costs any more to insure a GTi6 compared to a DTurbo even though they have nearly twice the power.

^^^ That's true, at 19 I had a Rover 420 GSI, 130bhp, leather, AC, cruise, and it was less to insure than the 1.2 Corsas my mates were knocking around in because it was an old man car. Looked and went well with 820 turbo wheels and all the chrome body-coloured though...

I agree with this. At 17 I had 2litre mondeo. Looked like shit but left the corsas and saxos for dust :-)

Plus ive had a look on comparison sites and the gti6 is cheaper for me to insure than the hdi. '6 is almost double the hdi!

[rtha6551]

While they can provide more in-depth tuition and better educate new drivers, what can they actually do to *STOP* new drivers getting in their cars after passing their test and thinking they're automatically able to drive quickly and have excellent car control skills?

Prevention is better than the cure as stated earlier, but how far can prevention go?

[Dum-Dum]

Yeah I had a mk1 2.0 Si Mondeo and it was cheap to insure and top end would give a GTi6 a run for its money. Had a ST170 manifold on mine for winnings

[306Puggy]

If anything id like to see a BHP limit on cars like they do bikes, i imagine theres a lot less risk to others by someone coming off their scooter than someone having their license for a week and binning an evo

How many times do I have to explain this!? Insurance IS the BHP limit, FFS. There is no need for stupid laws to come in, it's already naturally taken car of.

Puggy your wrong, its no bhp limit if you have loads of money or if you buy fast stuff thats rarely crashed also if you know what to look for you can have fast stuff cheap, this is why me and my mates had mondeos when we was younger.

My 3rd car was a 1.4 polo and I got a 1.4 as it was cheaper to insure than the smaller engined ones and the 1.6 would of only cost me another few quid.

Same with the fact it barely costs any more to insure a GTi6 compared to a DTurbo even though they have nearly twice the power.

None of those cars have a lot of BHP though Not even the GTi6 relatively speaking. Not the sort of thing that an inexperienced driver might poke the throttle on and put themselves through a wall.

[Piggy]

so you are saying a bhp limit of what? 200bhp? 300bhp?

when most cars attractive to that age band (hot hatches etc) are below 200bhp anyway!?

so a completely pointless bhp limit then

[306Puggy]

LOL, never thought I would see lil' piglet agreeing with me