General TD04 questions

[ste91]

Hi lads, I know you get loads of the same questions on these turbos (I've been searching) but there are a few things I can't find the answers to.

Now I don't own a Pug, I'm more into the MG/Rover L series diesels which are 2.0 direct injection however still very similar to the XUD in terms of power output, standard turbo on them is a GT1549, and not many people really push their L series where as you lot are doing loads, I've been following the likes of jammapic and Darren Lobb etc if only someone would do something like that with the L series!
There are a few people running VNT's and different turbos but hardly anyone has pushed the boundaries.

Anyway what sort of results are you lads getting with your TD04's?

- spool times?
- reliability? (Any blown engines?)
- power/torque figures?
- why are some people welding the wastegates? Is it purely a space issue? Surely having no boost control is a bad thing?
- what are they like to drive with, a lot of fun I expect?

[Piggy]

you will find all the answers to those Qs on this forum...keep looking...
there is a active thread on turbo info going on as we post!

---

PS sell the crappy rover and buy a XUD 306 too

[Danny2009]

spool times are around 300rpm later than stock turbo i found

Reliablity, its a tuned engine so isnt going to be top reliability i spat a rod running a td04 and there has been a few others that have.

i had 177bhp and 247 lb ft of torque on a thrown together tune on a 9mm

i had the gate welded on mine and controlled it by fuel, there isnt really space so just took it off

i love mine not too laggy and the power delivery when it comes on boost is quite savage.

Hope this answers your questions

[cwspellowe]

- spool times?

TD04 is designed for higher revving petrol engines, can appear laggy with spool near 3krpm but if the pump is gov modded, these XUD's can rev to 6k and make use of the blower. If the pump's not had the gov shimmed though they're a bit of a pointless upgrade.

- reliability? (Any blown engines?)

Not really common, at least not associated with this particular blower. Some XUD's have a habit of throwing rods but noone can 100% say why. Some spit them at just over idle, some throw them at 5krpm under boost. Mark Airey has had his TD04 on for a couple of years running 30+psi with no issues so far, touch wood.

- power/torque figures?

Common outputs seem to be in the 170bhp mark and 250+lbft

- why are some people welding the wastegates? Is it purely a space issue? Surely having no boost control is a bad thing?

Space issue, common TD04 orientation can make them awkward to fit behind the engine with the actuator on, but some have managed to squeeze it in. Having blown a de-WG blower by overspeeding myself i'd never do it, but the TD04's are pretty bulletproof and can eat monster psi.

Yes though, no boost control is a bad thing, even a bleed valve doesn't stop overspeeding of the blower, which is what killed one of my GT's.

- what are they like to drive with, a lot of fun I expect?

Quick, will eat GTI6's for breakfast with their torkz, and they sound like jet engines. Plus CJ and Jenks make bolt on bits for the blowers to strap them to the engines. £50 turbo + £25 oil feed + £60 adapter plates = 170bhp XUD for under £150. Not many cars will make that pound for pound increase.

[ste91]

Thanks

It might be worth noting the L series fuel pumps aren't too different to your mechanical ones however they are electronically controlled, can be remapped, but we're only talking a rev limit of 4.5k, it's mad how you can push the XUD to 5-6k!

170bhp+/250lbft sounds ideal though, not "too much" torque to risk breaking anything but with a nice power increase.

What are TD04's like "off boost"? Does the engine feel gutless or is it still okay tootling aroun at 2-2.5k rpm as you normally would for daily driving? On standard turbos you're easily on full boost by 2.5k rpm but then power tails off only 1000 revs after, making the top end of the revs feel very dull. I'm guessing the TD04 would still be pulling well into the 4.5k rpm redline?

[Danny2009]

mine used to be still boosting at 6k, its fine plodding about round town i never had any problem with it.

[Piggy]

and beyond...but its a lot to do with fueling...if the governor (mech or elec) is pulling back on fuel at 4/4.5 the turbo wont be spooling as high and hard...

XUD for the win

[ste91]

Are you seriously revving your XUD's to 6k or is that just a minority of highly tuned ones?

Oh and Piggy don't get me wrong I do like XUD's, it's the rest of the car I couldn't live with.

Although are we talking the same TD04's here? Are you using the 13T's or the larger ones?

[Piggy]

lots and lots of variables matey...

I can rev to 5k on veg oil with my standard kkk turbo and minor pump mods...

others with td04s are still pulling at 5k tho...esp with 11mm pumps

so you prefer to drive a rover?!?

[ste91]

Yes but I didn't come here to argue Peugeot vs MG/Rover (although Rovers really aren't as bad as they are made out to be, they are actually very nice to drive, however I'd only ever buy a diesel one).

Oh another thing I forgot to ask - are you on standard internals with your TD04's or are a few upgrades needed first? I've read a few posts where people mention rods going, but not the turbo's fault.

[Piggy]

most of us keep to standard internals...no issues

some put in HDi rods...bit stronger

[Dicky]

Yes but I didn't come here to argue Peugeot vs MG/Rover (although Rovers really aren't as bad as they are made out to be, they are actually very nice to drive, however I'd only ever buy a diesel one).

Oh another thing I forgot to ask - are you on standard internals with your TD04's or are a few upgrades needed first? I've read a few posts where people mention rods going, but not the turbo's fault.

I found my MG ZR TD is nicer to drive than any 306 I've owned, but I agree I'd only buy a diesel one but I still love 306's..

Theres a few people on standard internals around here I'm sure

[Piggy]

Only one experience of a mg zr...the owner boasted about it so much... it was a shed compared to my ph1...and stock power mine left him for dust.

MG...nice badge but still a rover

[Dicky]

Only one experience of a mg zr...the owner boasted about it so much... it was a shed compared to my ph1...and stock power mine left him for dust.

MG...nice badge but still a rover

mines 04 plate, 82k with FSH, SDi injectors, blanked EGR, dragon tuning box and a de-cated, brand new clutch with 8 months MOT and 4 months TAX I only paid £800 for it I'm not complaining, and stock left him for dust really? XUD's stock are gutless as feck and wouldn't touch a MG ZR petrol or diesel..

[Piggy]

yup...they are gutless...obviously not as much as his pathetic rover

[Dicky]

yup...they are gutless...obviously not as much as his pathetic rover

Either the guy you was racing can't drive, or your full of shit lol

[cwspellowe]

yup...they are gutless...obviously not as much as his pathetic rover

Either the guy you was racing can't drive, or your full of shit lol

+1

Standard XUD's are shite in all honesty. They only come alive when tweaked.

[Piggy]

I have never been that impressed by the MG range...to much hype made me expect more...
the 160 never feels like it has all that umph and the 105 diesel should have more umph for what it is

[bigcheez2k3]

Can we move on from the rover/mg bashing? This was turning into a rather informative thread.

[Piggy]

was it?!
repeating information about the td04 turbo which has been talked about so much already on other threads...a lot!

[ste91]

Well someone needs to turn their ego down and take their Peugeot blinkers off...

I didn't come here to dispute MG/R vs Peugeot, I just wanted some general diesel tuning knowledge for what are quite similar engines in terms of power when tweaked and have similar fuel pumps despite the mechanical/electrical differences.

Other posts were helpful though.

[jpderv]

standard they are both gutless but i have to say tuned they go quite well although a mate has an mg zr td sdi injectors and a remap its 155bhp and hes only a tiny bit quicker than me in my dt with a stage 1 tune but then again the rover could be heavier i dunno.

[ste91]

standard they are both gutless but i have to say tuned they go quite well although a mate has an mg zr td sdi injectors and a remap its 155bhp and hes only a tiny bit quicker than me in my dt with a stage 1 tune but then again the rover could be heavier i dunno.

Sounds about right with those mods, I think the MG ZR's are around 1100-1200kg depending on which model, not sure what the 306's weigh.

This is the whole reason I posted here though, very few have really pushed the L series past the 150-160bhp mark on the standard turbo with SDi injectors and remap, whereas you lot are running all sorts of different turbos. There are a few people running bigger turbos and VNT's on the Rover forum but not many have actually got them dyno'd or got them running 170-200bhp as a day to day car like some people on here.

[Piggy]

theres a link/thread on here to someone with over 200bhp from the XUD9

and 233bhp from the xud11...all be it a 2.1 in a bx...but there are a few here with 2.1s in their 306s

what seems possible is well over 150bhp without much money spent, and no reliability issues

[ste91]

Seen a few of them, jammapic and Darren Lobb were the main ones I was keeping an eye on.

Are all XUD's IDI or is the 2.1 direct injection?

Hopefully we can get a few 180-200bhp L series eventually. There's a guy developing some hybrid turbos (GT1752 hybrids I think) as a direct bolt on but it hasn't been tested yet. TD04 would be my next choice after that.
Previous hybrid attempts used the standard GT15 turbine housing and gave exhaust manifold pressure issues and caused a few heads to lift lol.

[Dicky]

Seen a few of them, jammapic and Darren Lobb were the main ones I was keeping an eye on.

Are all XUD's IDI or is the 2.1 direct injection?

Hopefully we can get a few 180-200bhp L series eventually. There's a guy developing some hybrid turbos (GT1752 hybrids I think) as a direct bolt on but it hasn't been tested yet. TD04 would be my next choice after that.
Previous hybrid attempts used the standard GT15 turbine housing and gave exhaust manifold pressure issues and caused a few heads to lift lol.

I was looking into those GT17 hybrids for mine, but atm its a longshot..

Yeah all XUD's are IDI

[Dave]

Are you seriously revving your XUD's to 6k or is that just a minority of highly tuned ones?

I could sit at 6k all day.... until I fitted a bigger plunger....

[con67]

hi buddy your engines direct injection so not really comparable to the xud, maybe tdiclub would have better info for you, eg ive a feeling your going to max out your injectors which isnt really a problem for us?

[ste91]

hi buddy your engines direct injection so not really comparable to the xud, maybe tdiclub would have better info for you, eg ive a feeling your going to max out your injectors which isnt really a problem for us?

Fuelling is not the problem, although we're only good for up to 4500rpm.

The main problem we have is the standard turbo (GT1549) is only good for 150-160bhp and that's really pushing it, there are no direct bolt on turbos and nothing that's easy to fit without custom adapter plates and downpipe and since the L series has such a small following there isn't anyone making parts and selling them like there is on here.

I've been doing a bit more reading and it seems that a few of you rate the GT2052 and GT2056 quite highly, so they might be more the sort of thing I should be looking at, I still like the TD04 since it's such a robust turbo.

Also you mention the L series not being comparable to the XUD, even though it's direct injection I think the power figures would be very similar if you had similar mods i.e. TD04, FMIC, straight through exhaust, and adequate fuelling, they would probably put out around the same power.

I'm not 100% sure what you'd consider a "stage one" XUD but a "stage one" L series is around 125-135bhp depending on the model.

[CJ_Derv]

Mine boosts to 6k nicely welded gate not had any probs, as far as i know mines a 15g but dont think that makes much difference may take a bit longer hitting full chat to the 13t but full boost at 3.3k but with fly 3.1k

im going to be building a 19T soon to go with 11mm pump but just havent the time

As for fun to drive yes they are, i kinda like a tad of lag because as soon as she kicks in she lights the tyres up in most gears

Just ignore some people on here and get on with it, some think they know everything there is to know and know f*ck all and tend to have the highest thread count but jus sayin lol

Crack on