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+--- Thread: 1.8 20v SMIC? (/showthread.php?tid=5812)
1.8 20v SMIC? - Oil-burner - 26-08-2012
Do we think a side mount cooler from a vagagay 1.8 20v would be ok for a stage 2?
I know they map to around 200bhp+ with just a file do what are peoples opinions?
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Midnightclub - 26-08-2012
Tbh i think it'd actually be easier to FMIC than SMIC, FMIC will be better for cooling anyway and probably easier to route the piping aswell
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Matt - 26-08-2012
From what I've read, I think he asking if it will be okay as a Fmic?
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - lolsteve - 26-08-2012
Yea that'd be fine, so long as you can make it fit. Provided you did set it up as a front mount , good to see people trying oem ones
1.8 20v SMIC? - Oil-burner - 26-08-2012
Well I was thinking there's a massive gap behind the N/S foglight (where the washer bottle would be on the O/S) and from there bit of a nip and tuck and your next to the gearbox! Sounds a lot easier than moving the rad, slimline fans etc etc plus I think I could do it with less pipe work because I'm not having to fight my way around the rad!?
That's how it played in my head anyway!lol
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Midnightclub - 26-08-2012
The pipes will be in PITA to route though as it's not intended to be used as a FMIC, by all means try it but i really think it'd be easier to grab a universal kit, especially the price you can get them for now
1.8 20v SMIC? - Oil-burner - 26-08-2012
That's where they sit on the TT 1.8 20v so can't see that being a problem, the inlet/outlet should be pretty much lined up for the job! Just wondering if it would provide sufficient cooling!
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Toms306 - 26-08-2012
Erm...you know they're crap right? Made of plastic and ally so seperate with the smallest amount of boost! Unless you mean the aftermarket turborevs one....may have one spare one soon.
Edit - infact, I've got a spare standard 20vt one too.....just needs the rusty map sensor screws removing.
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Midnightclub - 26-08-2012
Sorry mate, i wrote that comment before you posted answering the other guys and then clicked edit by mistake so it put my comment below yours, have you got a pic of the SMIC?
1.8 20v SMIC? - Oil-burner - 26-08-2012
Hmmm that may have put the brakes on a bit then! Just want to do it as cheap and as easy as possible tbh, I'm watching some pace ones off a fiesta rs turbo but id rather get one from a scrap yard so I can test fit it before coughing up the dollar for one!
Not got a pic on my phone, just seen them on eBay.
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Ed Doe - 26-08-2012
What size is the core? You need to maximise that, particularly if youre not going for a bigger turbo.
Also, you can't compare the perv turbo power produced to the derv one as a benchmark for how good it is. The perv turbo will be producing a hell of a lot less charge temp as the turbo is way better sized for the application. A t2/k14 by comparison is running outside its efficiency almost as soon as you play with it, hence the charge temps jump very quickly, and heatsoak is far more pronounced...
Another thing to factor in is that almost any intercooler set-up will support a singlle 220bhp pull on the dyno, provided the dyno fans are good and it's not sat there heatsoaking for ages. It's being able to support that power without it heatsoaking for even a 5minute hard drive that's the most important thing to look at too...
1.8 20v SMIC? - Oil-burner - 26-08-2012
No I'm not going any further than stage 2, it's my daily so need reliability! I'm not 100% set on the 20vt cooler as yet but definately swaying towards the side mounted option.
As I said I'm looking at some pace ones from a rs turbo.
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Midnightclub - 26-08-2012
If not, look for a jag 2.0D cooler, it's a FMIC and you could probably pick one up in a scrappy for £20, IIRC its the cooler dum-dum had originally on his HDi before changing to that monster one
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Ed Doe - 26-08-2012
Just realised you've got an hdi...
Get a twinpass FMIC, its literally the best solution for an hdi; minimises pipework and maximises frontal area and so efficiency...
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Toms306 - 26-08-2012
Depends how cheap the others are, but £100 for a brand new one means I cant fault this at all - http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-VW-GOLF-GTi-1-8T-TDI-POLO-BORA-SMIC-SIDE-MOUNT-INTERCOOLER-/320762147730?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item4aaee9f392
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Midnightclub - 26-08-2012
I will agree with ed here, twin pass is the easiest option IMO.. but the twin pass coolers themselves are usually a lot more expensive, single pass will require slightly more pipework but IMO it's something you wouldn't notice (lag wise), check out my old project thread if you wanna see how we did mine
1.8 20v SMIC? - Oil-burner - 26-08-2012
Yeah If this doesn't work I'll be going twin pass. That was my original plan but had the bumper off and it got me thinking.
Yeah I've seen the turbo revs one Tom but again for £100 I may as well get a twin pass fmic! Was really after something I could rip off a oem motor at the scrap yard but doubt I'll find anything tbh!
It's the extra messing about with pipe work that puts me off tbh! I know I'd get through easy enough with a twin but single pass I can see being a nightmare to fit.
Have you gone single pass? I'll have a look when I get home, I'm on my phone ATM and its a pain searching for stuff.
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Toms306 - 26-08-2012
(26-08-2012, 01:14 PM)Oil-burner Wrote: Yeah If this doesn't work I'll be going twin pass. That was my original plan but had the bumper off and it got me thinking.
Yeah I've seen the turbo revs one Tom but again for £100 I may as well get a twin pass fmic! Was really after something I could rip off a oem motor at the scrap yard but doubt I'll find anything tbh!
The problem with scrappy ICs is that most (VAG anyway) seem to be blowing oil as they've already covered a ton of miles.
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Midnightclub - 26-08-2012
Yes mate, my old HDi (emmas now) i did it with a single pass cooler and then just looped one side round to make it essentially a twin pass, few pics in my thread should explain it better
Like i mentioned earlier though the jag diesels have FMIC's which are perfect for this application if you could find one in a scrappy
1.8 20v SMIC? - Oil-burner - 26-08-2012
I keep watching eBay for a cheapo but I always miss them.
There was a full kit, cooler, pipes, silicone and mikalor clamps that went for £46 the other day!! I was gutted! Lol
Yeah I know what you mean, did you ave to move the rad at all? And obviously you had to use slimline fans.
What jag was it off, s type? If so they are just a Mondeo with a jag badge stuck over the blue oval! Lol
Tought about the tranny 2.5td as they seemed to be the cooler of choice when I had a xud.
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Midnightclub - 26-08-2012
You could've bought my old focus one off me! I sold it the other week though :/ they're also perfect for the application, look for a cooler from a focus st 225 too
1.8 20v SMIC? - Oil-burner - 26-08-2012
I'll find one mate...eventually! Just need to keep costs down as much as I can. Gonna use the 406 bottom pipe and I think I'm gonna try using a 1.9 406 dt top pipe as well to try to keep it as oem looking as I can.
How much did it cost for your setup roughly?
And how long did your std clutch last on a full fat map?
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Midnightclub - 26-08-2012
I used a 406 HDi top pipe to keep the bay looking OEM and it fits around the standard airbox too so you don't need to change to a cone filter..
Umm i'd say around £220 all in? (not including the clutch) but that was all NEW parts
Well cars still being used every day and is still on the full fat map, has been for about 6 months now and NEVER slipped once, as long as you have some mechanical sympathy and a NEW standard valeo it'll hold for some time before giving up the ghost
1.8 20v SMIC? - Oil-burner - 26-08-2012
Doesn't the 406 top pipe go towards the drivers side?
Yeah I definitely want to keep the standard air box, don't want a crappy cone! I've running a green cotton filter in it too so I'd be gutted if I had to get rid!
Not too bad then, hopefully I'll get most of it from the scrap yard. I've already got the inlet elbow and my old boost gauge so it's just a case of getting a cooler, top and bottom pipes, mbc and a pipe kit.
Well my clutch is less than 10k old and tbh it very rarely gets any stick. Can't afford any more points! Lol
I'm gonna ask Steve if he'll do me a limited torque map aswell just incase it kills it.
Not had it stage 1'd long but I'm getting bored of the power.
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Midnightclub - 26-08-2012
PM'd mate, No you can bend it the way you need to, pretty sure there's a pic of my engine bay with the 406 pipe in it somewhere in my thread
Yeah if you can get parts cheap enough there's no reason you can't do it for less than £100, also depending on what turbo you have, don't bother with an MBC, it took less than 10 minutes to do my boost via the actuator on my KO3
I had it on limited torque for a while before swapping it over, there is DEFINITELY a big difference between the limited and full fat maps though and it's definitely worth going full fat
1.8 20v SMIC? - Oil-burner - 26-08-2012
Cool, thought it just bent to one side!
Sound, the less money I have to spend the better really. I've no idea what turbo I've got to be honest, not looked.
Yeah I can imagine, did you have a stage 1 first or did you go straight to stage 2?
I know what will happen, I'll put the limited torque map on to save the clutch and I'll be bored again within hours! When you've got more power sat on your laptop it is impossible not to use it. Lol
Think that's how I killed the sedan, With the "f**k it, a couple more psi won't hurt!" attitude.
Went from the well behaved smoke free 17psi tune to bending the needle on my 30psi boost gauge! Lol
Pm replied
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Midnightclub - 26-08-2012
Yeah i was on stage 1 pretty much straight away after i bought the car and it stayed like it for just over a year and a half til i went stage 2
Yeah... that was why i put the full fat map on haha, it wasn't any more smokey but was much much faster.. just need to be gentle with the clutch and it'll be fine haha
1.8 20v SMIC? - Oil-burner - 26-08-2012
What you think to the difference between stage 1 and stage 2 then? You any idea what figures it's putting down?
I can't wait, need to get collecting my bits! Oh and I need to stop getting distracted by wheels!lol
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Midnightclub - 26-08-2012
Yeah buddy mine was dyno'd at 155.4bhp and 277 lb/ft
PM replied in regards to s1 and s2
RE: 1.8 20v SMIC? - Poodle - 27-08-2012
(26-08-2012, 01:02 PM)Ed Doe Wrote: Just realised you've got an hdi...
Get a twinpass FMIC, its literally the best solution for an hdi; minimises pipework and maximises frontal area and so efficiency...
Wrong, depends entirely on your set-up and what other changes you've made. There are other ways to do it with less pipework, but even that aside, the pressure diff. across a twin-pass is a lot higher than across a single, restricting the efficiency of your intake. It could be considered the easiest way to do it, but that's debatable too.
I would also recommend finding an OEM option rather than using one of the ebay specials, will be a lot better designed with regards to airflow, not to mention cheaper from a scrappy.
MNC, we couldn't get the st intercooler to sit nicely so the pipes were pointing in even vaguely the right direction, how did you have yours set up?