+- 306oc - Peugeot 306 Owners Club & Forum (https://www.306oc.co.uk/forum)
+-- Forum: 306 Repairs & Mods (https://www.306oc.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=22)
+--- Forum: Suspension, Transmission, Handling & Braking (https://www.306oc.co.uk/forum/forumdisplay.php?fid=19)
+--- Thread: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts (/showthread.php?tid=414)
Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Moonstone2.0 - 15-12-2011
Here is a thought...
My front wheel hub started chewing up wheel nuts in one of the holes. It cross-threads on the 2nd thread of the thicker part of the bolt nearer the head.
So is this cross-threading happening in the hub? With the thickness of the brake disk and the wheel, that thicker part of the bolt doesnt reach far enough to mate with the hub.
are there threads in the alloy holes? there isnt in the brake disk, thats just smooth holes.
Dont want to rip out my hub and put a new one in and find out that wasnt the problem.
Any help would be great!
Cheers
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - mark_airey - 15-12-2011
Moonstone2.0 Wrote:Here is a thought...
My front wheel hub started chewing up wheel nuts in one of the holes. It cross-threads on the 2nd thread of the thicker part of the bolt nearer the head.
So is this cross-threading happening in the hub? With the thickness of the brake disk and the wheel, that thicker part of the bolt doesnt reach far enough to mate with the hub.
are there threads in the alloy holes? there isnt in the brake disk, thats just smooth holes.
Dont want to rip out my hub and put a new one in and find out that wasnt the problem.
Any help would be great!
Cheers
2 stupid questions first:- have you checked the threads on the bolt?? and also have you tried another bolt in the hole??
because as you say, there are no threads in the disc and there shouldn't be any in the wheel either so if it does the same thing using a different bolt then it can't really be anything other than the thread in the hub.
Could always run a tap through and see if you can rescue it before swapping hubs maybe?
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Moonstone2.0 - 15-12-2011
2 bolts cross threaded in a row. then tried a bolt from the rear wheel and it seemed to tighten reasonably but not going to go crazy on it.
Bought a new hub, but the task looks a bit daunting to say the least! So just wanted to check I want being totally idiotic.
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - mark_airey - 15-12-2011
Moonstone2.0 Wrote:2 bolts cross threaded in a row. then tried a bolt from the rear wheel and it seemed to tighten reasonably but not going to go crazy on it.
Bought a new hub, but the task looks a bit daunting to say the least! So just wanted to check I want being totally idiotic.
Nah your not mate, I would try threading a bolt in just using your fingers with no wheel in place and see if you can see the problem although if it was a problem with the threads in the hub then I would expect it to cross thread on like the second or third turn not when its nearly all the way in :?
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Moonstone2.0 - 15-12-2011
That is exactly what is baffling it screws in all the way until you go to tighten it fully and bang, goes loose and spins freely. Can't do any more experimentation until I find more wheel bolts, dont have any more replacements
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - mark_airey - 15-12-2011
Moonstone2.0 Wrote:That is exactly what is baffling it screws in all the way until you go to tighten it fully and bang, goes loose and spins freely. Can't do any more experimentation until I find more wheel bolts, dont have any more replacements
The bolts your using haven't been used with spacers at any point have they that have flattened the last bit of the thread on the bolts?? if the last 5-10mm of thread at the top is buggered then that would explain it I suppose.............
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Moonstone2.0 - 15-12-2011
no that I am aware of, the bolts are perfect before they go in, even used a new shiny one to be safe but it didn't work. It only started happening after I sprayed my alloys so maybe it didnt like the constant swapping of wheels.
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - mark_airey - 15-12-2011
Moonstone2.0 Wrote:no that I am aware of, the bolts are perfect before they go in, even used a new shiny one to be safe but it didn't work. It only started happening after I sprayed my alloys so maybe it didnt like the constant swapping of wheels.
In which case then I would be swapping the hub in your position then as there isn't really anything else to try, bolts are the correct thread and all I assume?
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Jake - 15-12-2011
Sounds like a replacement hub is needed .. Its really not as daunting as it looks.. unless like mine your hub is seized to the suspension arm/pole/mount ( whatever its called ) then a very large hammer is needed
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Poodle - 16-12-2011
Sorry for the hijack - does anyone use any thread restoring tools they'd recommend?
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - darrenjlobb - 16-12-2011
As Mark has already said, sounds like the threads are bugger, altho id say more rounded out than crossthreaded...
Id get the hub changed, as you can try and fix the threads all you like, but if a new bolt goes round and round, then all the orignal strength is gone, and your just bending threads around, and will never be how it should be again..
Whip the hub off to be safe first as last... Fairly easy to do
1 - Remove drive shaft retaining nut (screwdriver in brake disc against caliper to stop spinning)
2 - Remove track rod end (undo nut so its over the end, hit with hammer to break free)
3 - Remove brake caliper (2 bolts behind it) and cable tie the caliper up out the way
4 - Remove brake disc (2 small set screws)
5 - Remove lower balljoint (remove pinch bolt from lower part of hub, and smash down on wishbone, will pop out)
6 - Remove driveshaft from hub (pull hub away from car, light tap to end of shaft may be needed, carfull not to split CV boots)
7 - Remove hub from strut (remove top pinch bolt from hub (or just remove nut if bolt wont come out) Smash down on the hub with lump hammer, its scrap anyway so dont worry to much about dinting it
By this point hub should be on the floor,
Reverse procedure and job done
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Moonstone2.0 - 16-12-2011
Thanks darren, time i invest in a bigger hammer me thinks!
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Dan! - 16-12-2011
Big hammer deffo needed! I changed the struts on my Bora a few months ago and only had a normal claw hammer to remove the hubs with, took me bloody ages!
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Matt - 16-12-2011
Echo what dan said, claw hammer takes agess!!!! Haha
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - jammapic - 16-12-2011
I had a similar problem when my wheel fell off on the M62... bought the relevant tap and just retapped / cleaned up the threads, it's never given me any problem since torqued up to 120nm.
JP
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Moonstone2.0 - 16-12-2011
Right more investigation is required...will get pics up soon because the hub bolt holes are not very deep and doesnt even reach the part which gets mangeled on the bolt! So confused! how can it spin freely if the lower part of the bolt, which is undamaged, is screwed into a hole that doesnt have an exit! Gah!
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Dan! - 16-12-2011
Just a thought, your not using extended bolts are you? Just wondering if the threaded section of the bolt is going all the way out the other side of the hub and then the 'blank' part of the bolt is just spinning inside the threaded part of the hub? Drawn a picture to help explain because I know that probably doesnt make sense
![[Image: boltdiagram.jpg]](http://i789.photobucket.com/albums/yy175/DanHargrave/boltdiagram.jpg)
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Moonstone2.0 - 16-12-2011
![[Image: bolt.jpg]](http://sanderson-brown.com/images/bolt.jpg)
the thread gets larger at the head and thats where it fails.
THIS IS NOT TO SCALE! i know the hub is thicker than the disk :p
The bolt does not go through the hub other wise it would catch on its support.
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - vincent1 - 16-12-2011
can you post a pic up of the bolts you are using ie 1 bad one one good one
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Connor - 16-12-2011
The only bit of the thread that actually does anything, is the bit that actually goes into the hub, either I havent understood something or something stange it going on lol
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - mark_airey - 16-12-2011
just throwing this out there but your not using tapered wheel bolts on flat faced holes in wheels are you??
Just seems like something isn't right, the threads sound like they are buggered but this would amplify the problem IMO!
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Moonstone2.0 - 16-12-2011
Ok, on the wheel nut front, the wheels are 14inch swallows and are probably the ones that came out of the factory with the car and looking at the state of the locking nuts, all the nuts are probably also the originals. The locking nuts are slightly different but the 12 other nuts are the same type and have had the wheels off loads of times without having a problem doing them up again. (well, snapped 2 over 2 years) but other than that they seem to be fit for purpose, other than this one individual one which has started this fuss.
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - mark_airey - 16-12-2011
Moonstone2.0 Wrote:Ok, on the wheel nut front, the wheels are 14inch swallows and are probably the ones that came out of the factory with the car and looking at the state of the locking nuts, all the nuts are probably also the originals. The locking nuts are slightly different but the 12 other nuts are the same type and have had the wheels off loads of times without having a problem doing them up again. (well, snapped 2 over 2 years) but other than that they seem to be fit for purpose, other than this one individual one which has started this fuss.
I know that harriers should have flat seated bolts so will presume that the swallows should be the same, if so then if the bolts have a tapered top they are incorrect for the wheels and will put loads of excess stress on the bolt holes! they will either be flat (with washers on) or tapered \ /
pics would be good, of locking bolts and normal ones, also if someone could confirm if the swallows are flat or tapered seats please as I can't remember
Re: Cross-Threaded Wheel Nuts - Midnightclub - 17-12-2011
Swallows are tapered mark, had to swap from tapered to flat seated when i changed from swallows to speedlines