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+--- Thread: just had a very pikey idea (/showthread.php?tid=35348)
just had a very pikey idea - bashbarnard - 17-12-2016
So arps head bolts, expensive and worth every penny on a big build. ive used there worth and intended to use there worth on another engine in the future. This being said im banging an engine together on an absolute shoe string budget for daily use and am trying to source some alternatives. arps are essentially really good non stretch studs. why cant i use high tensile bolts of the right grade with the right pitch thread. i cant for the life of me see why the hell not.
i am aware that this is a daft idea btw!! but you never know without trying in my eyes. just seems odd why no one has tried it yet
RE: just had a very pikey idea - Eeyore - 17-12-2016
http://vwdiesel.net/forum/index.php/topic,28462.0.html
http://www.enginebuildermag.com/2008/09/fastener-facts/
few bits ive found
RE: just had a very pikey idea - tigerstyle - 17-12-2016
Headbolts are usually 12.9 Grade ARP are above this in PSI tensile strength, but not by much.
RE: just had a very pikey idea - bashbarnard - 17-12-2016
12.9 grade is 176946psi, arps (2000 material they call it) are between 180000psi and 200000psi from what i can see online research and a standard stretch bolt is around the 150000psi and generally around the 8.8-10.9 grades. this is just from 30 mins research. i in no way condone this idea on someone else's engine than my own!!! just to make that clear i am NOT recommending this idea at this time lol
RE: just had a very pikey idea - BashRacing - 17-12-2016
Great idea I might give it a go !
Only kidding, I reckon a really decent quality set of bolts in that size and length won't work out that much cheaper than ARP's,
Being a daily won't a set of standard head bolts hold up or are you going big boost daily?
RE: just had a very pikey idea - bashbarnard - 17-12-2016
(17-12-2016, 08:51 PM)BashRacing Wrote: Great idea I might give it a go !
Only kidding, I reckon a really decent quality set of bolts in that size and length won't work out that much cheaper than ARP's,
Being a daily won't a set of standard head bolts hold up or are you going big boost daily?
always boost. always, its been 6-12 months without a good daily im bored as shit. could always just torque standard head bolts done a bit more
RE: just had a very pikey idea - BashRacing - 17-12-2016
I'll leave this here
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/big-power-citroen-c2-2-0-m-hdi-vts-vtr-furio-/172449040341?hash=item2826c387d5:g:fXkAAOSwa~BYSD7U
I know the chap selling this, tempted myself
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2003-Peugeot-607-2-0-hdi-diesel-110-Bhp-12-months-mot-/201748595854?hash=item2ef927448e:g:np0AAOSw2xRYT-5W
RE: just had a very pikey idea - bashbarnard - 17-12-2016
neither are a 306 though. plus i like my 306. plus the 16v mtdi is a good idea. i built a 8v one a while back and promptly bent a rod!! far to much advance but did work. I do intend to revist mtdi in the not to distant future but not yet. need to get the daily veg burner up and running again
RE: just had a very pikey idea - Piggy - 18-12-2016
You'll find once you spec them all up...not far off ARP pricing...plus who actually knows without testing
So you save a few quid...but then have pressure cooling systems...and start wondering... Or get ARPs and not worry
RE: just had a very pikey idea - Danny Wideboy - 19-12-2016
I say, nobody has any experience of trying something different, so why not?
If you're running a wastegate turbo you probably won't even need ARPs anyway IMO.
RE: just had a very pikey idea - zx_volcane - 20-12-2016
someone did have a set of studs made up in the not to distant past - not sure i saw a set fail, but equally don't think the price ended up being too far off a set of ARP
RE: just had a very pikey idea - darrenjlobb - 20-12-2016
Theres quite alot more to how the ARP studs are made than meats the eyes...heat treatment, rolled threads (not cut) all for extra strength... For what they cost, I personally wouldn't think much else would be worth bothering with, but always open to be proven wrong! A set of studs that were made back along were no where near strong enough however (when tested in a stress tester they failed at the same time as a STOCK stud iirc! Or something very close to that anyway!
just had a very pikey idea - bashbarnard - 20-12-2016
I mean i would only use arps on a big build, but this is a daily hack that im willing to try stuff out on as its not massive power and may benifit in the futre. I cant see why it wouldnt work, ive found some head studs that SHOULD work. But currently gathering info, ill only do it if i think they will work obviously
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RE: just had a very pikey idea - welshpug - 20-12-2016
I don't see anything pikey here, just research to a possible alternative, crack on.
RE: just had a very pikey idea - ConorTRG - 20-12-2016
I mind looking into arps before and I think the s2000 head studs were about right for the job, I never got round to trying them out must check if I still have the measurements of them.
RE: just had a very pikey idea - Piggy - 21-12-2016
(20-12-2016, 04:34 PM)ConorTRG Wrote: I mind looking into arps before and I think the s2000 head studs were about right for the job, I never got round to trying them out must check if I still have the measurements of them.
Nah not quite right