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+--- Thread: Front mount on stage 1 (/showthread.php?tid=29971)
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Front mount on stage 1 - JTaylor2005 - 05-04-2015
Alright guys.
Having had my stage 1 map done and a new clutch im proper happy with the performance.
My next step is to start preparing for a stage 2. Seeing as I have had a new clutch I am going to stay on stage 1 for quite a while tbf.
Am I right in thinking that o stage 1 I can run an intercooler and then up the boost a little. That would burn the fuel cleaner and also increase mpg a bit when driving normally?
What would be the easiest way to do the front mount? I would like to get it done in a day but I dont know how I could know I have all the parts I need. Are there any garages I could go to and actually do all the fitting and use their pipes and pay for them after when I have got all the bits I need for example?
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - shervo - 05-04-2015
You can fit a cooler on a stage one map but I dont think its advisable to up the boost until stage 2.
Take a look in the guide section someone recently wrote a FMIC guide.
As said to you before I own a self service garage so you could do the fitting at my place I also have some bits of pipe and silicone lying about but you would have to supply a majority.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - JTaylor2005 - 05-04-2015
Yeahh thats what I was thinking like a self service garage that had the boost pipes so I could just go from start to finish doing the whole lot and then just paying for the bits I use but I dont know if thats a thing haha
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Toms306 - 05-04-2015
No point keeping it stage 1 if you're going to the effort of FMIC'ing tbh. Increasing the boost is part of a stage 2 on these anyway so you may as well have a stage 2 map at the same time. If you can't control your right foot and are worried about clutch longevity maybe a reduced torque stage 2 would be the way to go.
Best thing to do would be to mock up the FMIC pipes before actually fitting them, then they just need a bit of cutting on the day, this is how I did the piping on the Golf. Or a bit more expensive, get a univesal 'kit' off ebay with loads of pipes and bends and you should have more than enough.
Some 'Performance' garages will do complete installs for you but that won't be cheap.... I've seen how much some of those garages want just for flashing someone elses remap lol.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - shervo - 05-04-2015
Yes I own one in Brierley hill not far from A1 clutches.
We can supply you the ramp/floor and tool hire I can also guide/help you through it as I have done mine myself.
As said though you would have to get a majority of the pipes from ebay/peugeot. But I have some odd bits laying about and there is also a performance shop round the corner incase you are missing some things.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - JTaylor2005 - 05-04-2015
Sounds good mate. Will definitly be a convenient way of doing it.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - shervo - 05-04-2015
Yeah just give us a call mate will do you a special deal for being part of 306oc. Call us on 01384 380 762 or 07763411295 and check out our workshop on www.motorhoist.co.uk
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Paul_13 - 05-04-2015
That would be me
http://306oc.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?tid=29759
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - JTaylor2005 - 05-04-2015
Nice. Will have to start getting parts together. I bought an inlet elbow but never noticed I got the wrong one that had the wrong end on it
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Iceman299 - 10-04-2015
(05-04-2015, 05:16 PM)Paul_13 Wrote: That would be me
http://306oc.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?tid=29759
Out of curiosity, how much did it roughly cost you to complete?
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Paul_13 - 10-04-2015
Add up all the ebay prices ;p
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Iceman299 - 10-04-2015
(10-04-2015, 09:06 AM)Paul_13 Wrote: Add up all the ebay prices ;p
Lol i just assumed there might've been more that wasn't mentioned.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Midnightclub - 10-04-2015
If you've got a front mount then you won't do any harm upping the boost a little, if it's a fairly heavy stage 1 tune then it'll benefit from it tbh. I ran mine with a FMIC, stage 1 and upped boost for a few months before going stage 2.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Poodle - 10-04-2015
Very little point, there won't be the fuel to burn anyway - think i got .03 on the smoke test with a heavy stage 1 and intercooler. Can't see it doing any harm though.
I see Paul hasn't mentioned cost of inlet and lower pipes, probably about £50 between them, you'll need a boost gauge as well, obviouspy with bits and pipes to T into the wastegate feed. Amd a slim line fan, as you won't be able to keep the standard unit.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Paul_13 - 10-04-2015
I purposely didn't mention the prices as people will acquire those bits at different prices /free.
But yes you're correct on the mbc and boost gauge which I was going to do a guide for and add it to what I've written
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Poodle - 10-04-2015
Not meant as a criticism, just a list of stuff for icemam to look up.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - pro_steve - 12-04-2015
In my opinion, if you fit an intercooler whilst still stage 1 it is perfectly safe to up the boost (don't go past 20psi), and you'll probably get a bit more power as you're running it a bit leaner.
You ideally need to up the boost at least a little bit because the pressure loss across the intercooler will give you a lower effective pressure at the manifold, although I think this is counteracted by the denser charge coming from the intercooler.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - JTaylor2005 - 12-04-2015
So for example if I was to drill and tap the elbow now without upping the boost what do u reckon I would find PSI wise?
Then after intercooler fitted it would theoretically drop and then I could up it with a manual boost controller?
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Uberderv - 12-04-2015
About 14-16psi.
It would drop post intercooler but stay the sameish pre intercooler. You just need to remember that the pressure drop needs to be added to your inlet manifold pressure to give you a rough idea of what the turbo is actually running at.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - MY95 - 12-04-2015
What figures could you acheive with the mapping pushed fairly high on a stage 1 with just an intercooler and no mbc etc?
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Paul_13 - 12-04-2015
I'll tell you soon. I'm hooking up a boost gauge and then
I'm putting an mbc on mine (stage 1+,fmic)
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - MY95 - 12-04-2015
Cheers Paul!
Was hoping Steve would be able to tell me a bit of info
Really cant be bothered with the unreliability of upping the turbo boost, already had to fork out for one turbo change.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - pro_steve - 12-04-2015
I've never really set up a stage 2 without a stage 2 map and increased boost, plenty of people run at higher boost with no problems. Just don't push it past 20 psi and you'll be fine.
I can make anything you want in between a stage 1 and a stage 2 power and you would just need to turn the boost up until you had adequate air flow to burn the fuel cleanly.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - MY95 - 12-04-2015
(12-04-2015, 09:49 PM)pro_steve Wrote: I've never really set up a stage 2 without a stage 2 map and increased boost, plenty of people run at higher boost with no problems. Just don't push it past 20 psi and you'll be fine.
I can make anything you want in between a stage 1 and a stage 2 power and you would just need to turn the boost up until you had adequate air flow to burn the fuel cleanly.
So it wouldn't be possible to do a very high stage 1 with the intercooler on to 135/140 bhp and 230lbfts ish without the turbo boost being upped?
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Paul_13 - 12-04-2015
I remember reading on here that some one went stage 2 without a IC and the turbo didn't last long at all
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - MY95 - 12-04-2015
(12-04-2015, 09:59 PM)Paul_13 Wrote: I remember reading on here that some one went stage 2 without a IC and the turbo didn't last long at all
Ive read that too, im on about a very high stage 1 WITH an intercooler though
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Poodle - 13-04-2015
Don't get too caught up with the whole "stage" thing, it's just a quick easy way of referring to common levels of tune. Tuning the engine works in the usual manner, more air is required to burn more fuel, it's as simple as that, what power you make depends on where you stop.
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - JTaylor2005 - 13-04-2015
Well currently mine is quite a high map for how my car was setup. I basically planning to get an exhaust and then wack and intercooler on with a boost controller and just turn it up 1/2 psi. Running much lower PSI than stage 2 often is but still slightly higher than stock.
That will give loads more air for the same fuel which would lower the smoke levels a lot and also efficiently burn the fuel that is being injected meaning more MPG and less wasted diesel as soot
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - MY95 - 13-04-2015
(13-04-2015, 06:08 AM)Poodle Wrote: Don't get too caught up with the whole "stage" thing, it's just a quick easy way of referring to common levels of tune. Tuning the engine works in the usual manner, more air is required to burn more fuel, it's as simple as that, what power you make depends on where you stop.
So what figures could you get on a very high stage 1 with an intercooler Poodle? With having the air to match the fuel or whatever
RE: Front mount on stage 1 - Poodle - 13-04-2015
Why have we still not got a facepalm smiley?
How much power you can make all depends on what mods you've made and how smokey you're willing to have it. Stage 1 is just a way of describing a map that caters to certain mods, it doesn't really mean anything. As Steve has said above, he can write a map that covers anything between the "stages". What mods have you got besides the fmic? Any more planned before the map? How smoky are you willing to have it?
The 110 hdi guys make 140-150 on a "stage 1", which is probably pretty similar to what you've got in mind, can't say for sure without any information from you though.