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Track car advice - Dan! - 10-02-2012
Im in a dilema guys :?
Me and my dad are very seriously looking into a track car for this summer and after speaking to him the other day we sorta decided we'd really like an E30 325i.
Points to consider��
- 325i is 170bhp standard (Although I know it will probably only be 160 tops nowâ?¦..)
- Should weigh sub 1000kg when stripped out
- RWD
- Apparently handles very well
- 2.5 litre petrol will probably do what, 5mpg on track?
- I expect upgrades will be fairly costly? (suspension, engine etc.)
- Should be capable of pulling upto 130mph fairly well on large tracks, probably more once tuned a bit.
Conclusion â?? Probably looking at around £700 for a decent one which isnâ??t falling apart/very rusty/has engine problems, or more like £400 for one which needs attention. Iv never worked on one before or any big petrol/rwd car, so would be all new to me.
However E30's are getting fairly rare now so we also considered E36 328i's. Slightly heavier car but then more power too (190bhp) and these are much more common to get hold of for cheaps.
Then theres the curveball, my old 205 :romance-inlove:
My head is sort of split 50/50 between which ould be better on track, but my heart is totally behind the 205.
Points to consider���
- Potential for 200bhp (Big pump, big turbo etc.)
- Should weigh around 700kg stripped out
- FWD
- One of the best handling hot hatches
- Will be fantastic on smaller tight tracks
- However will be poor on large tracks which have potential for 140mph
- Should still do ~20mpg on track
- Upgrades are relatively cheap
Conclusion â?? I know the engines and chassis very well so have no problem whatsoever tuning/modding it. I expect Carlos would be looking for around £600
and my heart is just telling me to buy it back 
So come on then, what do people reckon? Im looking for some fairly serious and informative answers, not just 'the 205 is awesome, get it'...... because we already know that
Talk to me..............
RE: Track car advice - declantg - 10-02-2012
I would say the BMW, I reckon as soon as you get sideways you will get addicted
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Re: Track car advice - Moonstone2.0 - 10-02-2012
Depending on ultimate funds, you will probably get more joy and more work out of the 205. The bmw will probably be better power and speed wise in the long run but with a hell of a lot of investment. What you want to do is invest half as much as you would for the bmw into the 205 and beat all the bmw's on the track
btw...
the 205 is awesome! Dafty!
Re: Track car advice - Eeyore - 10-02-2012
The 205. no question about it! You did all that work to it! Time to get it back, stick to what you know and have some good old fashioned hatch fun! Also on a track its like.... oh another old bmw... whereas with the 205 its more like... OMG did you see that guy with the different coloured gloves driving that blue 205 with yellow wheels!
Re: Track car advice - Dan! - 10-02-2012
Cheers for the comments so far. Keep them coming.
Sam that made me giggle
Re: Track car advice - mark_airey - 10-02-2012
Clearly the 205...............seriously, I can't even believe that your actually having to ask this...........just buy it back already,
205 + 306GTI lower arms = neg camber and epic handling!
XUD + big blower + pump = powers
Awesome handling + Powers = epic track car
Simples
Re: Track car advice - Dum-Dum - 10-02-2012
If your going for the beemer get the E36 328i as IIRC with an M50 manifold they get up to 240bhp so thats easy power.
But Im a peugeot nut so id say the 205.
I think youll find the 205 with 180bhp will keep up or beat the BMW becaues its 400kgs less and the torque will throw you down the trac at an unbeleivable rate.
IMO you wont have any trouble hitting 140 on bigger tracks with a gov mod and HDi box. My HDis have both been able to do hit the 4500 rev limiter in 5th with ease (and in not alot of space) and both hit just shy of 100mph on a standing 1/4 mile
Yes you may have a little less top end speed but being catapulted out of a corner by 300lb/ft in a 700kg car will be the more fun drive any day of the week.
Probably the only thing that would keep me away from the pug would be the thought of being able to take the beemer drifting.
Track car advice - Matt - 10-02-2012
205
/discussion
Re: Track car advice - darrenjlobb - 10-02-2012
Epic fail post, why cant I seem to edit posts without double posting at the moment?
Re: Track car advice - darrenjlobb - 10-02-2012
Dum-Dum Wrote:If your going for the beemer get the E36 328i as IIRC with an M50 manifold they get up to 240bhp so thats easy power.
But Im a peugeot nut so id say the 205.
I think youll find the 205 with 180bhp will keep up or beat the BMW becaues its 400kgs less and the torque will throw you down the trac at an unbeleivable rate.
IMO you wont have any trouble hitting 140 on bigger tracks with a gov mod and HDi box. My HDis have both been able to do hit the 4500 rev limiter in 5th with ease (and in not alot of space) and both hit just shy of 100mph on a standing 1/4 mile
Yes you may have a little less top end speed but being catapulted out of a corner by 300lb/ft in a 700kg car will be the more fun drive any day of the week.
Probably the only thing that would keep me away from the pug would be the thought of being able to take the beemer drifting.
The only other reason against the 205, is its likely to kill you in the event of anything happening on track / hitting a snail at anything over 2mph...
Bar that minor saftey concern, obviously the 205, because A its PSA, and B it runs on oil and has chronic boost....
Re: Track car advice - Seb_Ryan - 10-02-2012
e30 bmw ftw.. we got a rally one, quite tail happy though, cage was the most expensive out of all the upgrades.
And some of the 325's (the is?) have LSD's as standard which are alot better
+ you get the sound of a six pot rumbling away
Re: Track car advice - Ed Doe - 10-02-2012
Suspension upgrades are ridic expensive for Beemers IIRC.
I can't offer an unbiased opinion tbh, as I've never driven/been in a beemer driven properly. But you'll have a lot of cheap fun with the 205. and tbh given how expensive r888s, decent discs & pads are, not to mention the cost of trackdays themselves, you'll be better off with a cheaper car so you've got more change to get on track more often!
Re: Track car advice - mark_airey - 10-02-2012
darrenjlobb Wrote:The only other reason against the 205, is its likely to kill you in the event of anything happening on track / hitting a snail at anything over 2mph...
Bar that minor saftey concern, obviously the 205, because A its PSA, and B it runs on oil and has chronic boost....
Install decent weld in roll cage, problem eliminated
Re: Track car advice - Dan! - 10-02-2012
Okay, next question - how do I swing my dads opinion?
He's fairly open minded but he is 46 so I think his first comment would be, 'but its a diesel?' :think:Also, Driftability of the BMW is very tempting.........
Re: Track car advice - springs - 10-02-2012
Decent powered / spec'd 205's seem to keep up with decent cars on track with a good driver.
Although i don't know how good a diesel 205 will be but with decent mods it shouldnt be to bad.
Also depends on Budget and what you want to do with it exactly.. ie what Mods you want, do you want to be a full track only car or road going car with MOT / TAX and also insurance etc..
Re: Track car advice - mark_airey - 10-02-2012
Dan! Wrote:Okay, next question - how do I swing my dads opinion?
Also, Driftability of the BMW is very tempting.........
Get him addicted to boost, who cares that its a diesel, take him for a spin in it!
As for driftability, think of the cost of tyres, LOOS FTW
Re: Track car advice - Fozzy - 10-02-2012
forget it all and get a 306
Re: Track car advice - Dum-Dum - 10-02-2012
Best way to convince your dad is cost of upgrades for the BMW, cost of insurance if the BMW is to be kept road legal and cost of fuel on the track cos the BMW will do 10mpg or less.
Also If you get the 205 stripped to sub 750kg youll be able to tow it on an A-frame so you dont have to worry about on road comfort or blowing the engine.
To tow the BMW will need a fully braked trailer.
Re: Track car advice - hbomb1905 - 10-02-2012
Tatty bodied/interior early phase 2 gti6 in blaze will cost you pennies, strip it and then just do bits and bobs to it as you go along - as long as its mechanically sound with half decent tyres you can get on track straight away!
RE: Track car advice - declantg - 10-02-2012
Turn the bora into a track slag?
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Re: Track car advice - Ian - 10-02-2012
205. Epic speed isn't really required on a track day. It's all about the handling of which the 205 wins hands down.
Re: Track car advice - THE_Liam - 10-02-2012
I'd love to say the 205, and if it was a petrol I'd say do it. I know I'm gonna get flamed for this but having driven a couple of diesels on track I wouldn't ever have a diesel track car because of the lack of revs and narrow power band, not really a problem on the road if you drive it right but it really holds you back and spoils it on track IN MY OPINION
Of the other 2, I'd forget about the E30. You won't get a decent 2-door manual one for £700 these days, E30's cost big money especially with a 6-pot, and although the handling is good their pretty unforgiving at the limit, not a great first RWD car to be honest...
My money is on the E36 328i. Excellent handling, torquey but revvy 6-pot that with a new fannymold and remap is capable of 240 bhp, slick 'box, available for way under a grand these days, very tough and easily modded :mrgreen:
I've driven all 3, and I'd want the 205 if it had a petrol engine, but of the 3 I'd definitely have the E36 for the track
Re: Track car advice - Dan! - 10-02-2012
I reckon you might have got it right there Liam! .............. Hmmmmm
Re: Track car advice - Toms306 - 10-02-2012
TBH I'd go for the beemer of the two.
Re: Track car advice - Carlos182 - 10-02-2012
205! 205! 205! 205! 205! 205! 205! 205! 205! 205! 205! 205!
Re: Track car advice - THE_Liam - 10-02-2012
Dan! Wrote:I reckon you might have got it right there Liam! .............. Hmmmmm
To be fair, the Skoda is pissing me off with a couple of niggles and I'm starting to wish I'd bought my mates 328i for half the price...
Re: Track car advice - td_dan - 10-02-2012
205 definatly, 309 suspension setup, completly stripped with a 180bhp xud blowing epic coal its win all day long.
Although i may be a bit biased lol
Or dare i say a gti-6 205 also lots of fun. That way you get your 205 and your dad gets his petrol :grin:
Track car advice - Jonny b - 10-02-2012
Yep get a 205 as said 309 gti setup including rear beam for a wider track and would be awsome
Re: Track car advice - TheGateKeeper - 10-02-2012
I would love to see the 205 boosting around a track!! But I think a BMW would be better...
205 FTW
Re: Track car advice - Connor - 10-02-2012
Can't believe there's so much discussion about this... 205 do it or you're gay