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+--- Thread: Intercooler on stage 1 (/showthread.php?tid=11319)
Intercooler on stage 1 - aaron_one - 25-02-2013
Hey guys, in the long term i'm planning on going stage 2 so i thought i might take my time buying bits and pieces and fit them as i go along.
What effect would an intercooler have on a stage 1 hdi?
Also what would i be looking to buy and how much would the cooler set me back?
Thanks
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Slam Wagon - 25-02-2013
Not sure on the effects but ive just got my cooler and pipes. About £250, thats c5 bottom pipe, 406 inlet elbow, piping and an ebay intercooler.
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - lolsteve - 25-02-2013
Might see a slight horsepower increase depending on your stage 1 map, you will see less smoke though if its a smokey map and an increase in mpg i found.
You will need:
406 incooler inlet bend
406/c5 bottom turbo pipe
Intercooler
pipes depend on what intercooler you get and how you want to set it up
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - MIKE-FORD - 25-02-2013
this is what im lookin to do after my service and it been re remaped
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Eeyore - 25-02-2013
Ill be doing this in a few months time. What pipes and intercooler did you buy? Links to ebay please
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Dum-Dum - 25-02-2013
Stage 1 is faster with an intercooler, a reasonable bit faster actually.
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - RJDubya - 25-02-2013
Depending on the system and the turbo you may see slightly more lag, doubt it would be that noticeable though and when you're on boost because of denser air going into the system you should feel a bit more of a kick...
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Midnightclub - 25-02-2013
Baring in mind you can wind up the boost a little bit too so it'll blow completely clean
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Toms306 - 25-02-2013
Why wouldn't you just go stage 2 if youve gone to the effort and expense of adding an intercooler?
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Slam Wagon - 25-02-2013
Ive already got stage 1 and im getting myself set up to put stage 2 on. So intercooler will be going on hopefully this weekend and then save for a clutch and then that will get fitted then save or the remap.
He says at the top hes doing it piece by piece same as me.
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - lolsteve - 25-02-2013
(25-02-2013, 09:17 PM)Toms306 Wrote: Why wouldn't you just go stage 2 if youve gone to the effort and expense of adding an intercooler?
Because the costs of clutch/map?
That's whats stopping me going to stage 2
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Frosty - 25-02-2013
(25-02-2013, 05:17 PM)MIKE-FORD Wrote: this is what im lookin to do after my service and it been re remaped
Did you hear from long life about you re map?
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - aaron_one - 25-02-2013
(25-02-2013, 09:17 PM)Toms306 Wrote: Why wouldn't you just go stage 2 if youve gone to the effort and expense of adding an intercooler?
In the initial post mate, going for it bit by bit because i've not got cash overflowing out my pockets where i can just go BOOM stage 2, clutch, intercooler, the whole shabang lol!
Also how difficult is it to fit an intercooler? I can't see myself being able to do that :/
I would also be interested in the links for these parts, or even a pm letting me know all the parts i need in list format
Whoever takes the time to do this shall be knighted.... well i can't knight you but i will rep you
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - RJDubya - 25-02-2013
(25-02-2013, 10:11 PM)aaron_one Wrote:(25-02-2013, 09:17 PM)Toms306 Wrote: Why wouldn't you just go stage 2 if youve gone to the effort and expense of adding an intercooler?
In the initial post mate, going for it bit by bit because i've not got cash overflowing out my pockets where i can just go BOOM stage 2, clutch, intercooler, the whole shabang lol!
Also how difficult is it to fit an intercooler? I can't see myself being able to do that :/
I would also be interested in the links for these parts, or even a pm letting me know all the parts i need in list format
Its all dependant upon what you want from it, from performance to looks. Some people prefer the look of a twin pass intercooler, some a single pass, essentially the same parts needed with slightly different bends, lengths and routes etc. The most difficult part of this is finding a route that you're happy with and that doesnt restrict the air too much, its not that difficult to knock up a couple of mounting brackets and jubilee clip together some pipes
I dont think many people will be in a position to give you an exact list of what you will need as everyone does it differently, most of the members will give you pointer though, the rest is down to you to do some reading. Have a look at some of the project threads and PM the members to ask specifics of how they did things...
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Toms306 - 25-02-2013
Fair enough, stage 2 map doesn't cost much though does it? If it were me I'd just stage 2 it and go gentle on the clutch most of the time lol. But I cant be bothered with the hassle of fitting an ic, been there done that already lol.
Intercooler on stage 1 - kentiiboii - 25-02-2013
Me personally I'd fmic and restricted stage 2. That way you'd see about 140-150bhp iirc? But still have just enough torque for fun but not too much that your clutch shits it self.
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Midnightclub - 25-02-2013
I ran the hdi on a limited torque map for probably 4 months and its still good fun, probably about 140 bhp
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Arron - 25-02-2013
My clutch was fine until I turned the boost up.
I ran my intercooler on stage 1 fuelling for a few month with no issues
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Oil-burner - 25-02-2013
Feck that I want to feel the stage 1 - stage 2 jump!
Imo the op has the right idea, just do things in your own time, no point shagging the clutch completely just through impatience.
The half fat stage 2 money could be a good percentage towards doing it properly
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - aaron_one - 26-02-2013
I wish i knew what i was buying or even looking for haha, and the knowledge to fit it
i might have to get someone to fit it for me
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Poodle - 26-02-2013
Not being funny, if you can't cope with fitting your own fmic, you're not going to be able to cope with looking after it or keeping up with the increased maintenance on the car. The first two responses to your op explain what it is you need to build the system. Have a look around some of the HDi project threads, there's a lot of pictures in them that'll show you what you're working with and to give you ideas for your own install.
Tom, you've lost me tbh - what's the point of going stage 2 "properly" as you put it, if you're just going to pussy-foot around the accelerator anyway..? It just works out as more expense for the same effect in terms of power you can apply, difference being you don't get the satisfaction of burying your foot in the carpet now and again, surely that's completely backwards lol.
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Toms306 - 26-02-2013
The clutch can't be that bad can it? .I was assuming you could drive normally during the week, then have a bit of fun at the weekend - unless the HDi clutch is really that bad? I kept the standard pd clutch at 180bhp when everyone told me I couldnt - just have to be sensible with it. But I also found I didn't boot it even half as much anyway, not sure why, but with a slow car I guess you're trying to prove its fast (when its not) by booting it all the time.
Alternativly....could go restricted torque as suggested, maps are only 45 quid for vags so can't cost more for pugs surely lol, unless you go custom obviously.
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - aaron_one - 26-02-2013
is this intercooler a bit too small and gay?
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Universal-X-Small-FMIC-Bar-Plate-Design-430mm-x-140mm-x-65mm-With-57mm-Inlets-/380567022681?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item589b8fec59
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Slam Wagon - 26-02-2013
This is what ive got. Not plumbed in yet but looks a good fit for a single pass.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNIVERSAL-ALUMINIUM-550mm-x-172mm-x-65mm-INTERCOOLER-NEW-2-YEAR-WARRANTY-/290768752798?_trksid=p5197.m1992&_trkparms=aid%3D111000%26algo%3DREC.CURRENT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D14%26meid%3D5864598973547714073%26pid%3D100015%26prg%3D1006%26rk%3D1%26sd%3D290768752798%26
Then went to forge as its only up the road and its about £150 for all my piping.
Then you will need the two 406 pipes as mentioned above.
Alot of people prefer twin pass as there is a bigger gap on the passenger side of the radiator to get the pipes through. I will hopefully be doing mine this weekend and ill try and remember to take pics of it while im going.
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - aaron_one - 26-02-2013
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2-25-57mm-Universal-Intercooler-Pipe-Kit-Turbo-Diesel-PEUGEOT-206-306-307-HDI-/380577903535?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item589c35f3af
Is this a decent pipe selection to start off with? and then buy the extra bits when i can?
I was thinking i need something like this
-The above ebay pipe kit
-406 elbow
406/c5 bottom pipe (would need someone to point out what it looks like
-Intercooler
Various nuts and bolts to mount it properly
(26-02-2013, 11:07 AM)PE02KHG Wrote: This is what ive got. Not plumbed in yet but looks a good fit for a single pass.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/UNIVERSAL-ALUMINIUM-550mm-x-172mm-x-65mm-INTERCOOLER-NEW-2-YEAR-WARRANTY-/290768752798?_trksid=p5197.m1992&_trkparms=aid%3D111000%26algo%3DREC.CURRENT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D14%26meid%3D5864598973547714073%26pid%3D100015%26prg%3D1006%26rk%3D1%26sd%3D290768752798%26
Then went to forge as its only up the road and its about £150 for all my piping.
Then you will need the two 406 pipes as mentioned above.
Alot of people prefer twin pass as there is a bigger gap on the passenger side of the radiator to get the pipes through. I will hopefully be doing mine this weekend and ill try and remember to take pics of it while im going.
I would do twin pass but they seem to be a tad more expensive! The 406 pipe, is it the rhz elbow i need? Apparently there have been a few people who have got the wrong one.
With the intercooler does the 406 elbow go to the turbo and then once thats been to the cooler, it feeds back round back to the original inlet elbow? Just trying to grasp how it works
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Slam Wagon - 26-02-2013
Turbo - then silicone 90 elbow (not sure on the size of this, got mine with the bottom pipe) - then the c5/406 bottom pipe (from the 110bhp engine), this will give you a 63mm outlet next to the sump - intercooler piping (pretty easy to figure out a route, depends which cooler as to what piping is needed) - intercooler - intercooler piping (varies again will need to go round the rad an then up and over the engine next to the airbox) - 406/c5 inlet elbow, again from the 110 engine (this will have the opening by the top l/h corner of the airbox, pointing towards the front this will need a 57mm pipe).
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Poodle - 26-02-2013
Usually a standard hdi clutch will fail to hold anything from 250lbft upwards. Stage 2 will see at least 275, so you could just try it amd see if youd rather. Maps are about £150, or more if you go to a big company like derv doctor or longlife.
Thats quite a small fmic, but looking at the figures should be adequate.
Edit: those pipe kits are usually pretty good, plenty to play with.
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - aaron_one - 26-02-2013
(26-02-2013, 11:56 AM)PE02KHG Wrote: Turbo - then silicone 90 elbow (not sure on the size of this, got mine with the bottom pipe) - then the c5/406 bottom pipe (from the 110bhp engine), this will give you a 63mm outlet next to the sump - intercooler piping (pretty easy to figure out a route, depends which cooler as to what piping is needed) - intercooler - intercooler piping (varies again will need to go round the rad an then up and over the engine next to the airbox) - 406/c5 inlet elbow, again from the 110 engine (this will have the opening by the top l/h corner of the airbox, pointing towards the front this will need a 57mm pipe).
So what happens to the original inlet elbow? And what happens to where that usually bolts onto? Sorry if i'm being a bit intense with questions just really want to get my head round it before i make any commitments!
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - Poodle - 26-02-2013
Bin the old one, new one bolts on in relacement.
RE: Intercooler on stage 1 - aaron_one - 26-02-2013
Ah this is now making insanely good sense to me
Cheers for the pointers guys